Indian state revenue stamps, and stamped papers

birder · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2011 03:59:20 am

Stamps from Baudh I have never seen. Would you be kind enough to share some images.

Thanks and regards.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2011 04:00:44 am

Meanwhile, a new page from my album for kind perusal and comments from esteemed members.

ikanek · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2011 04:26:07 am

birder wrote:

Meanwhile, a new page from my album for kind perusal and comments from esteemed members.

So, it seems that you are getting better and better revenues. :lol:

More seriously, the first row represents Bhadarva, Khairagarh and Palanpur.
Second row: Bhadarva, Nandgaon. Then except Khairagarh examples from Rairakhol, Nandgaon, Charkhari, Talcher, Ramdurg and Jodhpur (Marwar district).
Their values lies in 3-10 $ range.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:24:07 am

ikanek wrote:

So, it seems that you are getting better and better revenues. :lol:

HaHaHa..... that must be the result of the excellent company I am keeping...on Stampboards... :lol:

More seriously, I have learnt so much here...and in such a short time...

Many thanks to Tony, Ikanek, Maptrekker, Bill Lewis, so many others...

birder · **Posted:** Wed Sep 28, 2011 13:17:05 pm

The princely state of MalerKotla never utilised the services of Thomas De La Rue & Co.

birder · **Posted:** Wed Sep 28, 2011 13:20:40 pm

And this example is only marginally better:

Are there any other examples of stamp papers or adhesives from Maler Kotla? I have never seen any.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Wed Sep 28, 2011 14:04:48 pm

birder wrote:

The princely state of MalerKotla never utilised the services of Thomas De La Rue & Co.

Never mind, Birder

Nor did Barwani ...

maptrekker · **Posted:** Wed Sep 28, 2011 15:28:44 pm

Check out the stamp illustrated in this interesting web page on Mala Kotla:

http://waqarkhan.com/malerkotla-info/

ikanek · **Posted:** Wed Sep 28, 2011 18:16:58 pm

Early Maler Kotla stamped papers are very nice (and true Uglies). Several series are reported leading to literally hundreds of varieties.

Also several series are known as adhesive revenue stamps.

Today, in my country we have a national holiday and I am not at home, so I will try to post some scans.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2011 00:17:18 am

First, some Baudh items:

1) Adhesive issues - first the most common issue from Baudh:

This stamp was issued either in green-blue, blue or green.

This series is much scarcer, only about 3 have been seen by me:

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2011 00:30:22 am

And now something extra for a birder lover - stamped paper for Copies from Baudh - in the central part with a beautiful peacock:

This paper is quite rare.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2011 00:38:41 am

And now more items from Maler Kotla.
First is to that as mentioned on the website posted by maptrekker here, but in a block of 4:

And here is much scarcer earlier type - provisional usage of stamped paper cut-out:

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2011 00:45:06 am

And stamped paper series:

The early one:

This small series is probably the most common one:

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2011 00:46:52 am

And here is series for Talbana use (Process Fee):

And similar for Non-judicial use:

birder · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2011 02:27:40 am

Many thanks Ikanek. Your selection of Baudh and Malerkotla is very very nice. Extra thanks for the nice peacock paper.

One of the Baudh stamps (small square white background) reminded me of a similar stamp (from Bamra?) that Tony had posted once..

Thanks and regards.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2011 03:44:51 am

The small Baudh stamp was also type-set similarly as Bamra postage second issue (also the first was type-set).

Here, is one interesting plate flaw which I call bird on head variety.

Complete stamp:

and detail of plate flaw:

This plate flaws occurred on at least 4 different types.

birder · **Posted:** Fri Oct 07, 2011 19:07:11 pm

Ikanek, that really DOES look like a bird on the head.

I checked all my stamps with a lens..but...no bird on head...

Meanwhile, this latest lot is presented for your inspection and comments :

The two identical stamps in the bottom row need identification (they are upside down..sorry..)

Thanks and regards.

ikanek · **Posted:** Sat Oct 08, 2011 06:58:04 am

The first row has two stamps from Suket state. I think this state revenues are true UGLIES. There are many varieties (only partially covered by KM) - at least hundreds if not thousands.

In the first example, if you look carefully, you can see by the Hindi denomination of 8 anna small part of previous denomination - maybe not complete erased transfer.

As I said before, there are many varieties of these designs - value in Hindi, Urdu and both, inscription in one line or two lines + different inscriptions, values, colors - black or orange, different inscriptions at the ribands at left or right, different styles of lines and also one important differences is the size of each stamp. So, you can clearly easy build up a very vast collection of these. I have them about 70 different including a block (or sheet?) of 12 and some other multiples.

The second row is Cooch Behar - uncommon state, Mehlog and two unrecognized stamps are from BANSWARA.

birder · **Posted:** Sun Oct 09, 2011 12:03:50 pm

Thanks for that Ikanek.

I have only one representative from Mangal. The hand stamp used on the adhesive appears to be the same as that used on the stamppaper. Do you have any other types from Mangal?

Thanks and regards.

ikanek · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 07:54:47 am

Mangal is quite rare state to get. One paper or document is not problem, but get more denomination is another matter. I have not more than 5 examples and one unlisted type - circular with value added by hand on the document. I will post image later tomorrow.

ikanek · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 06:19:09 am

birder wrote:

Ikanek, that really DOES look like a bird on the head.
I checked all my stamps with a lens..but...no bird on head...

Don´t worry if you don´t have one yet. This flaw is quite distinct so you don´t need to have a len or microscope to see it. It seems that this flaw occurred on one position in the sheets of 8 or 20. So it is not rare but nice looking.

Keep looking

(as probably nobody else noticed it yet) and you will find soon several examples.

ikanek · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 06:22:58 am

So, here the promised scan of Mangal unrecorded stamped paper. My copy has a manuscript of 8 annas value (outside the design):

birder · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 11:29:24 am

ikanek wrote:

In the first example, if you look carefully, you can see by the Hindi denomination of 8 anna small part of previous denomination - maybe not complete erased transfer.

As I said before, there are many varieties of these designs - value in Hindi, Urdu and both, inscription in one line or two lines + different inscriptions, values, colors - black or orange, different inscriptions at the ribands at left or right, different styles of lines and also one important differences is the size of each stamp. So, you can clearly easy build up a very vast collection of these. I have them about 70 different including a block (or sheet?) of 12 and some other multiples.

1. You mean to say that the stamps were printed for a particular denomination which was then "erased" and a fresh denomination printed. I think "erasing" is complicated business and not really worth the effort. Could there be another explanation?

2. It would be nice if you could share some images of different types of Suket stamps.

Thanks and regards.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:42:47 pm

Birder, I know nothing whatsoever about Suket revenues ... but erasing the value on litho stones wasn't all that uncommon. Bhopal did it for example, with SG 17-21

where only the value tablet was cleaned and replaced for each value. This meant that spelling errors, such as the 'NWAB' error (SG 20a) occur on all values.

birder · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:53:58 pm

Tony,

Kindly excuse my limited understanding. To me it appears that cleaning and replacing "only the value tablet" is quite different from printing one value, erasing it, and then printing another value using a different value tablet. In the former situation, there would be no question of any traces of the "previous denomination" being visible as is clearly the case with the Suket stamps.

Thanks and regards.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 13:43:39 pm

Well, we must wait for Ikanek's explanation, but it looks to me as if that is what happened with the Suket stamp as well.

After all, it does save a lot of labour. You lay down the basic design on the stone, 24 times in the case of the Bhopal stamps, and then change the words of value for each denomination. In the Suket case, it would involve two changes, for the figures and words, but this would still be simpler than re-drawing the whole design.

birder · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 13:52:39 pm

This would mean that the basic design is printed first, without the value for all twentyfour stamps. The value is then printed in the subsequent "presses", according to the denomination required for each stamp.

Then at what stage is the "erasing" required?

Thanks in advance for being extra patient with rudimentary questions.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 14:40:18 pm

Birder, this is how I learnt about the processes involved, myself: by asking questions. I'm more than happy to pass on what I know

You could do this on the old lithographic stone quite easily. The design was simply drawn onto the stone in negative with a special grease pencil. The stone was then inked, and only the un-greased portions of the stone would take up the ink. Apply the paper to the stone and lift off, et voilÃ .

So: In fact, the process is simpler, in one way. The printers would first print off the full print run of one value - say the 1 Anna:

Then they would erase just the wording in the value tablet, and replace it with, say 2 Annas,

and print off the full requirement of that value. They would then erase the words of value and repeat the process for the 4 Anna.

If you compare the images for the SG 19a and 20a above, you'll find that the designs - words of value aside - are identical. As they were drawn onto the stone by hand individually, they can really only be identical if the process I described was used.

birder · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 17:13:03 pm

Tony, here I would respectfully disagree.

The colour of the entire stamp is different. Your theory of only the value tablet being changed would have been correct if and only if the colour & design for the rest of the stamp had been identical in both cases.

Also, I may be wrong but to me it appears that in your two examples, the top right corners are quite different. The bottom left corners are also quite different. But at the same time there are many similarities too...

..all quite perplexing.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 17:43:54 pm

Birder, there was no need for the colours of the values to be identical. All that was needed was to apply a differently coloured ink to the stone, after the values had been altered.

I take your point about the frame lines joining the stamps in the corners, particularly at top right. Here is the cover, from which I isolated the SG 19a:

(I've just noticed that these two NWAB errors are from different positions on the sheet. The error occurred on stamps 2, 3 and 4 on the bottom row. The 1 Anna is from the bottom corner of the sheet; I'm not sure which position the 2 Annas came from. So please ignore that part of my argument. I'll have to dig out Owen Davies' descriptions of the positional characteristics of the stamps on the sheet, to see if I can find two different values from the same position. Don't wait up! This might take some considerable time ...)

The Viking · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 19:29:29 pm

Tony is correct about the NWAB error being on #s 22, 23 & 24. These can be distinguished by the presence or absence of other characteristics.

Firstly, look at the SW corner of the internal octagonal frame in relation to the N of NWAB. In #24, it points towards the middle of the N, in #22 & #23 the whole of the N is above the corner. The Brown example is #24.

#22 has a dot of colour above the middle of the M of BEGAM and a blob of colour between the H and the second A of JAHAN. #23 has neither. The Blue example is #23.

HTH,
--Andy

tonymacg · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 19:36:54 pm

Thanks for saving me from digging out Owen Davies' articles, Andy :lol:

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Oct 13, 2011 02:13:54 am

tonymacg wrote:

Well, we must wait for Ikanek's explanation, but it looks to me as if that is what happened with the Suket stamp as well.

After all, it does save a lot of labour. You lay down the basic design on the stone, 24 times in the case of the Bhopal stamps, and then change the words of value for each denomination. In the Suket case, it would involve two changes, for the figures and words, but this would still be simpler than re-drawing the whole design.

Well, Tony said that these revenue stamps were printed by lithography - that´s right. For any lithographic process the design was laid on the lithographic stone (often by very thin paper). I absolutely agree with Tony that such practice did save a lot of labour. The workers should only remove few inscription - and even possibly only the value printed - and value part in "the snowman" - as I call it. This not only save a time but also a material - the appropriate stone for lithography was found only in one German place. It is usual matter that the same stone was complete erased and used for several times.

Unfortunately, I have not enough material to confirm this suggestion. I am sure I have the same stamp. The second possibility (and much less usual) that the line I can see in the value inscription was in error left on the stone and new design was processed.

The first hypothesis is supported by the stamped papers of Jaisalmer - also printed by lithography and the same die was used for several denominations and only in few cases you can see small remnants of the other denomination. Moreover, one correction is known in this series - the wrong Urdu inscription was corrected and all othe design parts remained absolutely the same.

Just to be sure, try to post an enlarged detail of the Suket stamp.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Oct 13, 2011 02:18:16 am

tonymacg wrote:

You could do this on the old lithographic stone quite easily. The design was simply drawn onto the stone in negative with a special grease pencil. The stone was then inked, and only the un-greased portions of the stone would take up the ink. Apply the paper to the stone and lift off, et voilÃ .

That´s great and simple explanation how the lithographic process works.

I think it is great and much useful to know some basics of the various printing processes - see an useful article on Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Printing_techniques

birder · **Posted:** Fri Oct 14, 2011 13:03:02 pm

That was great. Thanks Tony, Ikanek.

I have learnt so much about printing and lithography in the last two days. I can now visualise stones being cleaned, value tablets being inserted and different impressions taken.

I also referred to this page:

http://www.stampboards.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=12818

On 22.6.2009, PeterS had posted an article relating to lithography and Glen had posted a large image of the complete stone showing the inverted Swan (4d) from Western Australia.

All in all a very educative and rewarding experience.

Thanks and regards.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Fri Oct 14, 2011 14:15:55 pm

Although Bamra used a different process - typography rather than lithography - it used the same basic approach as Bhopal and Suket.

The Bamra printers set up the basic forme of 16 stamps

and then changed the English and Oriya values as required. (It was a little more complicated than that in practice, but that was essentially how they produced the seven different values from ¼ Anna to 1 Rupee.)

There are some rather silly forgeries of Bamra, made by someone who overlooked the changing of the values:

(The forgery is on the right

)

birder · **Posted:** Fri Oct 14, 2011 14:26:10 pm

I (and presumably many others) would have fallen for this Bamra forgery. Hence I would not call it "silly" unlike the actually silly Charkhari fakes you had posted earlier.

Thanks and regards.

maptrekker · **Posted:** Fri Oct 14, 2011 14:29:32 pm

It looks like there were two types of ornaments, and that they didn't much care which way they were set.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Fri Oct 14, 2011 15:17:00 pm

Actually, there were three lengths of ornament used. The bottom four stamps in the first of the nine settings had extra long ornaments, similar to those in the forgeries. Unfortunately, I don't have an example (though when I acquired the forgery above, I thought I finally did have one of the long ornament. That is, until I looked again at the Oriya value :oops:

) And you're right, Maptrekker: the printers didn't care which way they went. This is quite a little help in plating single stamps.

All the changing of the English values did give rise to the occasional, collectable, spelling error - such as in this pair of SG 28 and 28a:

These are from positions 11 and 12 from Setting VI.

ikanek · **Posted:** Fri Oct 14, 2011 15:32:07 pm

tonymacg wrote:

(The forgery is on the right

)

The forgery on the right has Oriya value of ¼ anna denoted as EK PAISA instead of EK ANNA. But otherwise the forgery is quite convincing.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Fri Oct 14, 2011 15:41:35 pm

You're quite right, Ikanek. The forgery is quite convincing, except for the fact that every value of the forgeries - from the ¼ Anna to the 1 Rupee - is inscribed EK PAISA :lol:

birder · **Posted:** Tue Oct 18, 2011 05:38:03 am

This is most informative. I checked a number of ebay sellers and their Bamras. I was easily able to identify the few fakes. Thanks Ikanek, Tony.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:16:56 am

New acquisitions..No Bamras. Eye Burfi for Ikanek.

This looks similar to(and yet different from) the handstamped Rairakhols I have.

and..

How can the colours be different in a joined pair?

birder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:17:54 am

This one I have not been able to identify at all.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:20:11 am

One of the smaller stamps from Baghal. How many are there of this type?

birder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:21:43 am

The famous water colour from Datia. Does this appear genuine? I have another copy on an 1895 document. When was this stamp issued?

birder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:24:38 am

The big mystery stamp

ikanek · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:25:08 am

birder wrote:

New acquisitions..No Bamras. Eye Burfi for Ikanek.

This looks similar to(and yet different from) the handstamped Rairakhols I have.

Yes, it is really a receipt stamp from Rairakhol. This one is with the countersignature of K.C. Samalla who had been also a stamp superintendant in Bonai state for very short time. Two basic versions of the handstamp are known - with or without the word Dewan at the bottom central part.

ikanek · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:27:29 am

birder wrote:

New acquisitions..

How can the colours be different in a joined pair?

I think there may be several reasons for this:
1) color changelling - one stamp was more on the sun and became a little bit bleached
2) due to poor color managament
3) due to some chemical treatment

I think I have similar pair or a pane of 4.

ikanek · **Posted:** Tue Nov 08, 2011 03:30:08 am

birder wrote:

This one I have not been able to identify at all.

This one is from DASADA, a smaller state in Gujarat. So you can use this stamp to practice Gujarati script. The word Dasada is mentioned at right.

Two series with similar look are known - Court Fee and General.


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Indian state revenue stamps, and stamped papers

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