Indian state revenue stamps, and stamped papers

maptrekker · **Posted:** Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:08:58 pm

Congratulations. From what I have been reading, K&M is the best reference for the serious Indian States revenue collector. But as I recall, there is a third volume which I think was a supplement to the other two.

birder · **Posted:** Sun Nov 13, 2011 01:02:00 am

maptrekker wrote:

But as I recall, there is a third volume which I think was a supplement to the other two.

Thanks for that Maptrekker. I checked my Volumes carefully.

1. 1983 - Vol-I K&M (The adhesive stamps)
2. 1986- Supplement to Vol-I K&M (adhesive stamps).

So it seems that I have K&M for adhesive stamps and not for stamp papers.

Thanks and regards.

ikanek · **Posted:** Sun Nov 13, 2011 06:39:50 am

Vol. II - is for stamped papers and also includes second supplement to adhesive issues (but not such many additions as in supplement volume).

Vol. I - is for adhesive issues and also contains some basic info on the subject.

Supplement Vol. - is first supplement Vol. for adhesives only.

So, if you have only adhesives - then you have Vol. I + supplement Vol.

ikanek · **Posted:** Sun Nov 13, 2011 06:40:37 am

And if I remember right - Vol. II was issues in 1989.

birder · **Posted:** Wed Nov 16, 2011 14:54:59 pm

Are there any stamps depicting Begum Amanat Fatima of Basit Nagar? She ruled from 1871 onwards.

Has anyone seen any stamps from Basit Nagar?

ikanek · **Posted:** Wed Nov 16, 2011 16:12:19 pm

birder wrote:

Are there any stamps depicting Begum Amanat Fatima of Basit Nagar? She ruled from 1871 onwards.

Has anyone seen any stamps from Basit Nagar?

Basit Nagar did not issued any postage or revenue stamp.

birder · **Posted:** Thu Nov 17, 2011 01:15:28 am

Challenging identification:

The words Bhawani Singh and Rathore etc indicate Rajasthan origin. Probably some Thikana.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Nov 17, 2011 07:35:28 am

Not much challenging if you have seen them before. You are right it is thikana Ahor of Jodhpur. These circular handstamps are often very difficult to identify. I think I could write interesting article for India Post and possibly also here.

You have here 12 annas value which is already listed in KM as no. 106.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Nov 17, 2011 07:36:58 am

And just today my 5-frame exhibit on Bonai state revenues and stamped papers is available for study on Exponet website:

http://www.japhila.cz/hof/0740/index0740a.htm

birder · **Posted:** Thu Nov 17, 2011 13:45:04 pm

The surface of this stamp appears to be talcum powdered. What could be the possible reason?

birder · **Posted:** Thu Nov 17, 2011 13:46:25 pm

ikanek wrote:

Not much challenging if you have seen them before. You are right it is thikana Ahor of Jodhpur. These circular handstamps are often very difficult to identify. I think I could write interesting article for India Post and possibly also here.

You have here 12 annas value which is already listed in KM as no. 106.

Thanks for the Identification. KM 106 refers to Vol2 it seems.

ikanek · **Posted:** Fri Nov 18, 2011 02:17:36 am

birder wrote:

The surface of this stamp appears to be talcum powdered. What could be the possible reason?

In the old days, several collectors used talcum or some other powder in stockbooks in order to avoid attaching stamps to the background. But it is not good idea.

maptrekker · **Posted:** Fri Nov 18, 2011 04:23:22 am

Quote:

And just today my 5-frame exhibit on Bonai state revenues and stamped papers is available for study on Exponet website:

I have started to look at your excellent Bonai exhibit. I am impressed with the amount of detail presented.

There appears to be a lot of original research throughout. Congratulations.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 22, 2011 01:28:09 am

Ikanek,

Your Bonai exhibit is very comprehensive. It is taking a lot of my time. Thanks for sharing.

Meanwhile, on a different wavelength, some identification assistance is required.

Thanks and borregaards.

ikanek · **Posted:** Tue Nov 22, 2011 03:15:17 am

birder wrote:

Ikanek,

Your Bonai exhibit is very comprehensive. It is taking a lot of my time. Thanks for sharing.

Meanwhile, on a different wavelength, some identification assistance is required.

Thanks for looking. I hope that you find it interesting.

This stamp scan you posted here is quite small, but it is significant design which I call two-ear design. This design was used only by two thikanas of Jodhpur - thikana Balunda and thikana Riyan. Both designs are very similar in shape - but Balunda type is more wide than that of Riyan. So, I think it should be thikana Balunda. In the Balunda type the right portion of the lowest line reads as 42 whereas in Riyan it is expressed as 1942.

The value in both thikanas´ papers were added by hand in the lower panel in the design.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 22, 2011 03:41:56 am

You are right Ikanek. "Thikana" and "Balunda" are the last two words in the second line on the handstamp.

Thanks and regards.

birder · **Posted:** Wed Nov 23, 2011 22:59:04 pm

Another Thikana I am having trouble identifying.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Nov 24, 2011 01:49:02 am

This is also a Jodhpur thikana - Auwa. This is the most Ugly series from this thikana. I also have some of them, although not more than 10.

birder · **Posted:** Thu Nov 24, 2011 02:08:58 am

This one is a zapper.

Why do you say it is Auwa? The text states "Riyasat Suratgarh" or "Riyasat Naresgarh" or something like that.

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Nov 24, 2011 02:37:30 am

birder wrote:

This one is a zapper.

Why do you say it is Auwa? The text states "Riyasat Suratgarh" or "Riyasat Naresgarh" or something like that.

Well, this one is pretty difficult. Your possibilities look good, but... Suratgarh is known but lies about 300 km far from Jodhpur and was part of Bikaner state. I can confirm this by a document with Suratgarh cancels - from the pre-stamped paper era.

Naresgarh received no results in Google.

The Auwa thikana jumped on me as I remember this being offered as from Auwa and I have marked it so. But it may be totally wrong.

If you have this document try to decipher complete text. Here should be written something like Court .... and where it was located. Also check the back of the document.

I looked in my database and have found several others, but pictures are very small (only enabling to see the denomination and color). One of them has even a cancel in English, but the part with thikana name is blurred.

daddytug · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 09:16:04 am

Hello State Revenuers!

I've been collecting States revenue stamps for the past seven years and it's great to find a nest of people with the same addiction. I've been trying to catch up on all the posts and learned such a lot, especially from my old friend Ikanek. Congratulations on your Bonai exhibit, Ji?i, it's very impressive!

As for myself, I'm generally attracted to printed (rather than handstruck) court fee stamps, particularly those with plating potential, such as Karauli, Bamra, Porbandar etc. etc.

I've also just acquired a large number of Barwani and I see there is a lot of Barwani expertise on here so I hope I can pick people's brains as I sort my way through them!

best
David

tonymacg · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 09:30:04 am

David, I've been interested to follow these

types from Barwani, and I'd be delighted to see anything you can contribute to the story. Ikanek is the man to ask about the Court and Writing Fees, though.

daddytug · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:44:29 am

Thanks Tony, but I'm afraid I'm not going to be much help with the Barwani revenues -- I've just acquired John Trowbridge's collection of court and writing fees but the revenues were sold in a separate lot last year I think. It did include some revenues on documents, as well as a few postage stamps used as revenues, but no large blocks I'm afraid.

I'm really interested in the pre-1934 court fees -- for instance the 8 annas printed in yellow and grey:

Trowbridge speculated that this was an attempt at a security printing but they really look quite a mess as the alignment is invariably out.. As far as I know that's the only value they tried this with, but there may well be a lot of other things out there..
From comments I've seen, it seems opkedia52 is the man with the Barwani revenues so I'll send him a message.

cheers
David

tonymacg · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:37:15 pm

I was wondering who bought Trowbridge's Barwani, and now I know half the story at least

That Court Fee you show is very interesting. It shows that the Ranjit Printing Press had an even longer history of experimentation than I thought. I'll be interested to read anything more you can add.

In the meantime, member opkedia is certainly the man to talk to about Barwani Court and Writing Fees. Too big and clumsy for me :lol:

opkedia52 · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 22:02:00 pm

daddytug wrote:

Hello State Revenuers!

I've been collecting States revenue stamps for the past seven years and it's great to find a nest of people with the same addiction. I've been trying to catch up on all the posts and learned such a lot, especially from my old friend Ikanek. Congratulations on your Bonai exhibit, Ji?i, it's very impressive!

As for myself, I'm generally attracted to printed (rather than handstruck) court fee stamps, particularly those with plating potential, such as Karauli, Bamra, Porbandar etc. etc.

I've also just acquired a large number of Barwani and I see there is a lot of Barwani expertise on here so I hope I can pick people's brains as I sort my way through them!

best
David

Welcome to stampboards and with this you will enjoy your addiction of Indian states (aka "ugly")much more than earlier and i wish you success in your endevaour to make a good collection of Indian state revenues.
I have recieved your mail and replied .i will be away for next ten days so any email will be answered after 10th only.
Thanks.
opkedia

ikanek · **Posted:** Fri Dec 02, 2011 02:57:45 am

daddytug wrote:

Hello State Revenuers!

I've been collecting States revenue stamps for the past seven years and it's great to find a nest of people with the same addiction. I've been trying to catch up on all the posts and learned such a lot, especially from my old friend Ikanek. Congratulations on your Bonai exhibit, Ji?i, it's very impressive!

As for myself, I'm generally attracted to printed (rather than handstruck) court fee stamps, particularly those with plating potential, such as Karauli, Bamra, Porbandar etc. etc.

I've also just acquired a large number of Barwani and I see there is a lot of Barwani expertise on here so I hope I can pick people's brains as I sort my way through them!

best
David

David, welcome on the board Stampboards.com.

I am glad to hear from you again. I thank you very much for your kind words about the Bonai exhibit. It was quite an interesting to put this together.

Plating potential of many issues is really great. It only depends on how deep you must dig out. :lol:

birder · **Posted:** Fri Dec 02, 2011 03:27:42 am

birder wrote:

Today, I recieved THREE different scans of htese papers for identification. On one, I was able to figure out the Urdu characters on the central circle as "Narsingarh".

One more mystery cleared.

ikanek · **Posted:** Fri Dec 02, 2011 03:39:19 am

Birder is right. I checked KM and it is listed as Type 15. Only 5 rupees in red is listed.

However, the illustration in KM is very poor.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 14:57:50 pm

I have acquired a small lot of stamped papers and am in the process of sorting them out. Shall be posting some of them here for tips and assistance in identification.

Stamp A-1:

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 14:59:33 pm

Another copy of the same stamp : Could the Urdu indicate "Digod" as in thee+Gode?

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:00:39 pm

Stamp A-2 :

Is Mahargarh Raj Kotah different from Maihar?? Should be..

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:01:39 pm

Black Stamp A-3 :

This one appears indecipherable

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:02:36 pm

Stamp A-4

This one has stumped me too:

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:04:26 pm

Stamp A-5

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:06:11 pm

Two similar stamps A-6

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:08:37 pm

This should be easy. These two similar stamps are for Sadar Kota. Some department "Super...... is also mentioned which I have not been able to figure out.

Stamps A-7

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:44:51 pm

Stamp A-8 :

This one is not so difficult.

It is an 1867 stamp from the Mahakma (department) Political Agent of Bundelkhand.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:46:11 pm

Stamp A-9:

The scribble on the side indicates it is from the office of the political agent.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:51:52 pm

A better version of stamp A-9?

The year can be seen as 1858.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 16:46:59 pm

Stamp A-10

Three Similar images

and

ikanek · **Posted:** Thu Dec 08, 2011 04:04:21 am

birder wrote:

I have acquired a small lot of stamped papers and am in the process of sorting them out. Shall be posting some of them here for tips and assistance in identification.

Such documents with this type of cancel (intaglio style) are known from variety of states. Nearly all of them have no value indicated and are extremely hard to identify.

These documents are generally older than usual stamped papers and were used at various courts before introducing stamped papers. Therefore they are similar types as pre-stamp covers for postage stamps.

Such items are worth from 1 USD as some of them are very common - e.g. Tonk.

birder · **Posted:** Sat Dec 17, 2011 10:38:19 am

Does this Kashmir example represent revenue usage? Sorry for the tatty condition but it is the best I could manage.

tonymacg · **Posted:** Sat Dec 17, 2011 10:54:31 am

The stamp seems to be a ¼ Anna brown, which was the postcard rate, and there doesn't seem to be any obviously postal cancellation. By elimination, it seems to be a fiscal use, but I can't say I remember ever seeing another. (Of course, some of my loose ¼ Annas could have originated in the same way

)

Bearing in mind that the Kashmiri rupee was valued at considerably less than the British Indian - half the Indian rupee at times - this would have been a pretty small amount.

ikanek · **Posted:** Sun Dec 18, 2011 08:53:44 am

tonymacg wrote:

The stamp seems to be a ¼ Anna brown, which was the postcard rate, and there doesn't seem to be any obviously postal cancellation. By elimination, it seems to be a fiscal use, but I can't say I remember ever seeing another. (Of course, some of my loose ¼ Annas could have originated in the same way

)

Bearing in mind that the Kashmiri rupee was valued at considerably less than the British Indian - half the Indian rupee at times - this would have been a pretty small amount.

I also have not seen any JK postage stamp used as a revenue. The ¼ Anna could only pay some petition basic stationery paper as other fees were much higher.

maptrekker · **Posted:** Sun Dec 18, 2011 09:21:45 am

Some questions on the cover/document:

How complete is it? Is it possible that there were additional stamps above the single stamp?

Is it a single sheet of paper -- like a document, wrapper or cover front?

birder · **Posted:** Sun Dec 18, 2011 13:13:51 pm

maptrekker wrote:

Some questions on the cover/document:

How complete is it? Is it possible that there were additional stamps above the single stamp?

Is it a single sheet of paper -- like a document, wrapper or cover front?

Pertinent questions Maptrekker.

This particular sheet appears to be complete at the top. The stamp is affixed about a third of an inch below the top straight edge. There does not appear to be enough space for additional stamps above this stamp.

I would tend to agree with Ikanek that this is more of a petition paper or pice paper. I have seen two paise pre-printed petition papers from Kotah affixed with adhesive stamps for many annas. Pice papers or Pie papers were only one twelfth off an anna.

The black Hand stamp below the adhesive has some interesting (but very faint) Urdu markings.

The beginning of the bottom line has , what appears to be the year of usage as 1923. Would this not be rather late usage? If this number does not represent the year of usage, what could it be then?

People making the notings/jottings on this "petition" have extended certain alphabets so as to almost "cancel" the text and prevent reuse. I have seen this practise elsewhere, though I can't remember where.

More questions then answers.As usual.

Thanks and regards.

maptrekker · **Posted:** Tue Jan 03, 2012 15:21:10 pm

Any ideas as to the origin of this stamped paper? It has never been used.

birder · **Posted:** Tue Jan 03, 2012 17:19:53 pm

maptrekker wrote:

Any ideas as to the origin of this stamped paper? It has never been used.

Sometimes the watermark is of great assistance..

maptrekker · **Posted:** Wed Jan 04, 2012 00:56:10 am

That is an excellent suggestion. The paper has a large crest watermark that is fully half the length of the paper. It is not the same crest as on the stamp, and does not seem to have any lettering.

ikanek · **Posted:** Wed Jan 04, 2012 02:14:38 am

maptrekker wrote:

Any ideas as to the origin of this stamped paper? It has never been used.

Well, this paper is from Sikkim and surely issued after Independence (value is in paise not annas).
Surprisingly, these are quite common in unused state. I don´t recall much of them being actually used.


*Click For Our Newest Issues*	*Click for our Current Auction*	Internet Auctions-Buy & Sell Stamps	Melbourne 2013 - May 10-15

Postage Stamp Chat Board & Stamp Bulletin Board Forum

Indian state revenue stamps, and stamped papers

Who is online