Postage Stamp Chat Board & Stamp Bulletin Board Forum
 

We have begun posting SPECIALIZED pages on the "Leaders of The World" Automobiles and Locomotives stamp series issued between 1983 through 1988.



The rumors and over exaggerated statements about what was printed and what exists is to now be put to rest.

ALL catalogs , articles, and words will have to be either changed or IGNORED as we have documented proof of what really happened.

Statements like "Large quantities" and "millions" and "huge hoards" have devalued the issues way below what they are really worth.

For the past 20 years because of a few who used WORDS to harm the printing company, owners reputations and the integrity of the stamps themselves this has occured.

Proper research was never done. It HAS and IS being done now.

This will be the first section revealed to the collecting community on the LOW issues. As time goes on more studies will be presented and we will post them here for discussion.

We WELCOME any new evidence anyone can provide. We also welcome challengers who wish to argue against the evidence.

Please remember one thing. If you wish to challenge the findings then you had better have PROOF! Words will not be accepted without it.

We have been researching the printer for 15 years.

Some images and linking are not complete as the project is huge and ongoing. We feel that because the sale of the Police Evidence Stock has begun (Released in 2008) that collectors and dealers need this information asap. Therefore we are starting the engines earlier than planned.

Enjoy the show and watch it grow!

The Researcher

Well as to FACTS, this stuff was around the wholesale trade in MAC TRUCK LOAD type volumes 20 or so years back.

Try and re-write history as much as you wish (never worked for the Russians and East Germans, but go for it) but the FACT remains that vast amounts of this stuff was sold at waste paper type price levels.

Not rumour, not fiction, but FACT - there was near unlimited quantities around wholesale, and they could be bought for way under 1% of face value.

How do I know? As I bought a lot of it, and sold it also for a pittance .. at a slightly higher pittance than I bought at.

I'd sell things like 250 different MUH Train stamps - from all those uninhabited Tuvalu Islands and Caribbean places, face value $XXXX for a song. And sold them in sheet lots - i.e. 50 sets of MUH Trains .. all different - 250 in each set - Face value $XXXXXX - the LOT for $XX etc.

They sold pretty well.

All very pretty, and well designed and printed, but total philatelic WALLPAPER with as much validity as most of the Trucial States junk of decades before.

Allan Grant from Rushstamps in the UK had, and still does have vast qualities of it last time I looked.

Send him $1,000, and he'll ship you a large carton of it to this day I'd suspect.

East Coast USA wholesalers like Campbell Hall had it on offer in vast lumps. Greg Manning wholesale auctions had this stuff by the large carton in sheets.

Come up with all the 'research' you wish, but it will not alter the main fact - this was pretty junk printed in vast quantities to be sold to the packet and approvals trade essentially.

Glen

This wallpaper is all over ebay to this day - this guy sells 100 different MUH of the junk above for $24.99 - post free.

That is the sort of thing I sold at $2 per set of 100, in full sheets back in the day.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/USA-RAILROAD-COLLECTION-100-TRAIN-LOCOMOTIVE-STAMPS-Leaders-World-/130602592149

I thought it was April 1 again? Perhaps not.

Do any major catalogues even bother listing this fluff?

Not even "real" stamps, not valid for postage in most cases - just repeated thematic wallpaper for kids.

If the printings were lower than everyones been led to believe then anyone with a stockpile (perhaps the OP!? ) will be able to double their value and now they might be worth 5 for a cent instead of 10.

Ah the 80's, making stamp money while the sun shines.

I'll stick to my MUH collection of Staffa. It's going to be huge one day!

_________________
Greg - Looking for Goulburn Australia Cancels and Grangemouth Scotland Cancels and Covers
Member of the S.T.A.M.P Club for Slightly Twisted And Mad Philatelists - Motto: "Bring back the lick!"

As someone who compiled the Stanley Gibbons 'Collect Motor Vehicles' catalogue of course these Leader of the World car stamps featured (though some from the uninhabited islands were in an Addendum).

Call them wallpaper if you wish but the designs were of the highest quality, drawn with technical precision, not photographed, with a background sympathetic to the nationality or purpose of the car (or train) very accurate and extremely attractive. I liked the way a profile design of the car/train was also presented.

The original artwork of any design would be something which any car fanatic would proudly frame and put on his or her wall.

Way more impressive than 90% in fact of the the stuff which is issued today by so called respected philatelic nations. Most stamps today are 'designed' on a computer with overlay photography that any monkey could be trained for and then then 'photoshopped'.

The facts regarding issue numbers, lack of commercial use and the sheer number of designs may well make the purists blanche. But credit to the artists (and I mean artists) is also due.

I have copies of the American magazine Collectible Automobile and issues from the 80's featured two page ads for the car series, aimed at the people who loved or owned a collector car, in many instances a car depicted in the series.

I'm sure they bought quite some issues, though they were 'car guys' not stamp collectors. However a small number may have later become stamp collectors in a wider sense, so stamp collecting may have benefited long term.

It probably was one of the earlier aggressive attempts to market stamps to collectors of the theme rather than stamp collectors. Nowdays no matter what one thinks of this attitude, every national Post Agency in the world directly follows this process slavishly.

If anyone has any credible information on the series I would be happy to read about it.

And to those who say some issues never appeared used on cover I would dispute that. I have Tuvalu issues of their subsidiary islands which were used by the Tuvalu Philatelic Centre for mailings. OK maybe not commercial mail per se but some people will split philatelic hairs forever.

These days of course we should be delighted if a letter from the man in the moon lands in our letter box with a commemorative stamp.

Rabbit

Rabbit - I posted above they were attractive.

Lots of wallpaper philately is attractive - it does not make them kosher stamp issues.

Please post images for interest, of any commercial mail you own from ANY of these windswept and possibly uninhabited rocks below, that had their names on the Tuvalu stamps, as the stamp issuing entities.

I suspect not a single cover exists. Hence the non listing of this junk in real catalogues, despite the garish hype below.

And as for the website writer - presumably poster #1, imputing as he has that the Crown Agents had anything to do with this junk - or selling it, is total and utter FICTION and he may quote me. I hope they sue him.

Glen

With so few posts on this thread to date, it still seems to have gone in about Forty Eleven different directions, so I will make it Forty Twelve, and for once, be very brief.

Nobody cares about these stamps. The Kiddie market is dead, the world completionist is almost dead, and I suspect that the demand for most of these issues is zero.

So, common or rare, it does not matter.

Norm

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Geelong, VFA Premiers 1878, 1879, 1800, 1882, 1883, 1884, 1886, AFL Premiers 1925, 1931, 1937, 1951, 1952, 1963, 2007, 2009, 2011, .

To your corners gentlemen. Wait for the bell, and come out fighting! This looks as if it is going to be good.

_________________
With kind regards, Jim

I can see that quite the heated debate has begun as I knew it would.

FIRSTLY I would like to state that yes, if you were to take ALL of the LOW trains and cars issues (regular issues) and put them together then you would fill SEVERAL Mac Trucks with the material.

Let us do a bit of math. 56,000 pairs in panes equals 2240 panes. Now multiply that by the number of values in a series set...say set of 4 values. 8960 panes. Hmmmmm...THAT might fill part of a MAC TRUCK. And THAT is only one set!

There were over 900 different values issued for the LOW Trains and Cars series. Yes...I think you would need quite a few MAC TRUCKS to haul all that!

Re-writing history and revealing the TRUTH about history are two different things. Much history has been changed because secrets and rumors and lies have been discovered and proven later which in turn changes history as we know it. This IS the case with many of the LOW issues.

Let us ask the question....Do you have a ton of the material now? I think not. Statement was.


You see yes at the time they were available for pennies because that is the way of stamps. Look at the present day Royal Wedding issues. They are EVERYWHERE. Same scenerio.

Now...the question is....can you buy them in the same quantities at the same price now? Very doubtful.

My point is....these are all words. No proof....no evidence. Where are your records proving you had "millions" of a single issue? Where are your pictures showing "millions" of a single issue? Where are the documents proving there are "millions" of ANY value of this series produced in the "millions"?

There is none...that is why. Only rumors and lies. Oh....someone went in and saw a bunch of boxes and looking at them "assumed" that there are "millions".

You see...you have to use logic and intelligence to figure out what the truth really is. Not words and rumors.

What would it cost to make a million copies of one value of the LOW trains? Please include paper, ink, design costs, employee costs, equipment, gum, packaging and shipping costs. Do you think that anyone with an intelligent business mind would produce millions on the hope that someone is going to buy them all for a profit? I think that the owners of the printing company would not. Consider they are millionaires and millionaires do not become millionaires through business by making STUPID decisions.

Now let's get back to today. Beddaustamps sells panes of the series at between 14-28.00 on ebay as stated by "the Sheriff". His father bought up much of the remainders at the time the issues were sold through the various agencies. SO? If you were to study it at all you would see that quite a few of the issues he no longer has or never did have. Proof of millions? I think not.

Just because you sold them for $2.00 means they are worthless? We should base our opinions on that fact? I would say perhaps if you had done the research that WE have you may have been a bit more conservative about your judgement in the selling of it!

I have bought much Egyptian philatelic items at pennies only to turn around and sell them for several dollars. Today the same items are selling for $50+! So since I sold them for a couple dollars should they be considered worthless and should be considered "wallpaper"? I think not. Wish I had them now is all I say.

So...we should base the produced amounts on your sales? Nope.
Again....show the proof.

You see...one thing that is backfiring on the instigators of the rumors and exaggerated statements is the trial evidence exhibitions themselves produced by the procecutors. We believe it was hoped to be destroyed and lost as the British Courts only retain this type of material for 7 years. It was not and thus WE have the proof that the same instigators of the rumors and statements had against the various companies which proved that they were NOT GUILTY of ALL charges. Thus we have whole exhibits showing the process of ordering, printing AND shipping of numerous issues for many countries INCLUDING LOW issues.

Do YOU have this? Rewriting history? It is already written. It was just never shown.

In closing I would like to just state that the story of the LOW issues and as some call it "a debacle" is long and very complex as the issues are. We welcome debate but again stress that without evidence words really mean not a lot. My site is dedicated toward unravelling the mysteries of the Format International Security Printers Ltd. and what REALLY happened. I am the lead researcher on the subject as apparently....nobody has ever made the effort to figure it out.

Also in closing I would like to present to you another FACT as to WHY you think "millions" were produced of each value. Another sort of mathematical equation and a picture.

Picture a box 1.6'x1.6'x1' weighing 22k (48.5 pounds). In it are 4 packets of progressive color proof panes of LOW trains. Each packet contains 117-119 panes of each of the 7 stages of printing. ONLY 4 values will fit in the box(one being placed sideways). Can you picture it?

Now here is a picture of some of the St. Lucia/Tuvalu side of the Police Evidence Stock seized by the British Metropolitan Police for the trials. There are only a few REGULAR perforated panes and uncut press sheets in the whole thing. They are all progressives, specimen overprinted and imperforates of which all are of limited quantities ie; 1,000 to 5,000 sets.
Then tell me that if you saw this on a GRAND scale including the St. Vincent/Nevis side in crates and only looked at a few on top that you too would think MILLIONS and MASSIVE and thus the rumors begin.......

The Researcher

A comment on this vindictive comment. I guess they will have to sue Beddaustamps and others as well then.

Please check your research on stamps issued by St. Lucia etc; before making such disgruntled statements.

The Researcher

The Researcher? Long posts full of RANDOM capitals, that read like they were written by a paranoid flat earth theorist ... probably aren't going to convince anyone. Just sayin'.

Also, these things have the slight problem that even if there were only a dozen surviving examples of one of them, the total world demand is probably about half a dozen.

Useless comment mozzerb and totally wrong as sales of CityCollectibles lots on eBay proves. As for long posts...sometimes long posts are required to get a point across. Usually people that don't like them have short attention spans.

P.S. on the Mac Truck thing. Mac trucks aren't big enough. Let's use the U.S. term "18 wheelers"

Several....

As someone who has never heard of these, could someone summarise what the trial was all about?

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With kind regards, Jim

Actually, as a relatively cheap, easily obtained side collection...

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With kind regards, Jim

You can read a somewhat biased version on the trial by googling "philatelic scandal".
Or you can go to my main page on the Format International Security Printers and find the link there to the same page. An interesting read but please take it with a grain of salt as the site IS geared against all LOW issues. Tuvalu was one of the main instigators causing the trials.

If YOU lost the trial what do you think you might do to justify yourself?

The Researcher

What a bizarre thread. Like most here, I've always written them off as junk & it'll take more than a few pictures of 'rarities' to convince me otherwise. I would be very interested to see commercial covers - dated appropriately -though.

Cheers. Mike

As I know very little / nothing of the facts behind these, I voted "undecided".

Being a large scale worldwide collector, I have a gut feeling these were printed in lesser numbers. Yes, I've seen these occasionally in mixtures I buy - but nowhere close the quantities I see stamps I know were printed tens of millions. So I suspect the print runs were notably smaller.

As I collect used and CTO-used only, I can say coming up with canceled copies seems very difficult. I have got only few such (CTO) specimens. But I've seen way too few of these to say anything really conclusive.

I agree with The Researcher that only facts shoulds matter. And it's great somebody's doing research and pushing out knowledge.

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See pics of my latest stamp findings at Stamp Collecting Blog.

You appear to be arguing with yourself.

No-one on this thread said they had millions of these.

Yet you accuse someone of saying it, and in the same post AGREE there were vast numbers printed - truckloads literally - clearly more than millions produced.

You must have fared very poorly in debating class.

The only member who said he had bought large numbers of this junk at the time was me.

I did not use the word I had owned "millions" - but I did say -

Whether they printed "millions" of each and every variety and issue or just hundreds of thousands, won't change the one key important factor here.

They are still not worth anything above what they are currently worth now. If more are released onto the market after being tied up in court evidence for the last few years then their value will go down even more.

So exactly what is the whole point of the argument about how many were printed? What are you hoping to enlighten people with?


PS - Your a web designer? Then why is the website almost unreadable with the colours used? It doesn't read very "friendly", nor is it easy to read. This is constructive criticism, not a commentary on what you wrote.

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Greg - Looking for Goulburn Australia Cancels and Grangemouth Scotland Cancels and Covers
Member of the S.T.A.M.P Club for Slightly Twisted And Mad Philatelists - Motto: "Bring back the lick!"

Mail from a philatelic bureau to collectors...I'd say its 99% philatelic, 1% commercial. Yes, they're doing business, sending out new issue brochures for marketing purposes. But its from a stamp seller to stamp collectors. They could just pre-print "postage paid Tuvalu government" in the corner and the international mail system would accept the envelopes, the stamps franking the envelope are just to 'pretty up' the envelope.

So I would consider those as a big fat 'No' as proof of legitimate useability.

Can anyone show that a tourist or secretary from a local small business walked into a PO in Tuvalu, was handed stamps inscribed for Funafuti or one of those other coral rocks, stuck it on a letter and posted it? For instance in St. Vincent they squarely say "stamps inscribed Bequia are not allowed on mail from the main island, only for use on Bequia."

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Collecting Mongolia; Thailand; Indo-China; Mourning Covers; OHMS.
My online 'store': http://stampsfromaethelwulf.blogspot.com/

Still not quite seeing the point of all this. It really does not matter how many of these exist, as the Philatelic World is not waiting with baited breath to go out and try to corner the market in Funafu, Nanumea, Niutao, Nui, Nukufetau, Nukulaelae or Vaitupu.

Let's say you actually establish quantities sold, I still say so what? Is this going anywhere apart from the intellectual interest you have in such things?

Norm

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Geelong, VFA Premiers 1878, 1879, 1800, 1882, 1883, 1884, 1886, AFL Premiers 1925, 1931, 1937, 1951, 1952, 1963, 2007, 2009, 2011, .

Does this qualify as a commercial cover?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/St-Vincent-Gren ... 1c259ff6c1
or

http://www.ebay.com/itm/St-Vincent-Gren ... 1c25b0999c
and

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ST-VINCENT-1980 ... 519a8e4917

The first two are not Commercial use, as the are first day covers, and not even addressed to anyone. Commercial mail by definition is something that has been through the post.

The third one is a possibility, as it is actually addressed (to a stamp dealer). I suspect that many Commercial cover collectors would reject it, as the cancellations are not even tied to the cover, so you could start creating these seven days a week from SOTN CTO'd stamps.

ETA - I got a few of these in some Kiloware I purchased last year, on small piece, and the cancellations did not look remotely close to genuine. I class them as tat.

Norm

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Geelong, VFA Premiers 1878, 1879, 1800, 1882, 1883, 1884, 1886, AFL Premiers 1925, 1931, 1937, 1951, 1952, 1963, 2007, 2009, 2011, .

I agree ... the violet and turquoise text on a black background, is horrendous.

First of all, not ALL islands of the Commonwealth issued these type of stamps. Malta is an island in the Commonwealth and never issued these "Leaders of the World" wallpaper.

Also, can you show us a postally used stamp from Bequia, Union Island, etc. or Funafuti, Nanumaga, etc. By postally used I mean any cancel other than a PHILATELIC BUREAU - KINGSTOWN - BEQUIA or similar cancels from the other islands.

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My wantlist for Malta Revenues

This is another quote from your webpage (PS Allanswood and Eric Casagrande are right about your webpage colours).


Why are the 8000 stamps which are imperf, specimen or specimen imperf needed? To be sent to the UPU or for collectors? (I think that is a VERY difficult question to answer )

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My wantlist for Malta Revenues

18p per stamp, my goodness! probably more than the average face value for these issues!
No wonder someone went belly up. If the invoice is accurate.

Why deliberate imperfs and specimens? Easy, deliberately printed "rarities", so to have the full set, you must buy 4 of each stamp. Bring on the colour progressive proofs!

This was at the forefront of the wave of "carp" money making issues we see today.

_________________
Greg - Looking for Goulburn Australia Cancels and Grangemouth Scotland Cancels and Covers
Member of the S.T.A.M.P Club for Slightly Twisted And Mad Philatelists - Motto: "Bring back the lick!"

For me, whether or not the stamps were printed in the thousands rather than hundreds of thousands or millions is beside the point.

Personally, I can think of many examples where legitimate stamps have been printed in small numbers, but this doesn't necessarily ensure the value of the stamps will increase. Supply and demand is essential for a stamp's value to increase.

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Chris de Haer
Author of 'A Closer Look at Modern Australian Stamps' in Stamp News Australia.
Latest news on my blog http://stamps.chrisdehaer.com.au Follow me on Facebook twitter.com/stampchris

Millions (or even MILLIONS) would doubtless cost (or COST!) far less pro rata, even if later printed from already created plates/cylinders -- since most of that invoice total is presumably for the setup charges?

Even if 21K sets is the total printing (as Allanswood says, that seems like a poor business plan if so) there's still the supply and demand problem. As stampchris and fromdownunder point out, there isn't enough of the latter to increase the price significantly, unless of course talk of rarity produces an enormous number of people wanting to get in on the act (which again, doesn't sound like a winning business plan).

Wow! Getting a lot of input here. This is good!

I will try to make this shorter for those who do not like long posts.
tough to do though with so much going on.

Firstly comments on web design are useless to this subject. I COULD post
around 100 comments of how "beautiful" my site is and how entertaining.
If you don't like it.....how about you figure out how to change the fonts and
background in your OWN browser so you don't HAVE to see the "horrendous colors".

Ok....the first point we are trying to establish is that millions of a single value or set from this series were not printed. as we can see in the early polling a bit more than 50% believe they were printed in this fashion.

Apologies to the Sheriff but the statements on Mac Trucks and such add fuel to rumors as the entities that started them hoped they would. Any large series produced by many countries would require the same sort of transport. The point given and shown is that each country involved did not have huge quantities printed as perceived by the statements written in articles, noted in catalogs, and spread through word of mouth over the past 20 years.

On issues pertaining to postal validity all were postally valid for mailings. Just because there are not many used(not CTO) covers and stamps out there does not ascertain validity. Asking to see cancels other than the cancel from a given country as in "PHILATELIC BUREAU - KINGSTON - BEQUIA" is like asking to see cancelled stamp from the U.S. without a U.S. cancel. The main post office is in Kingston. I do not know the policies of their particular postal service but would put the suggestion that the mailings from the islands are not canceled until they reach the main post office in Kingston. Thus the commonality of the cancel. No stamps are "added" as with stamps of Lundy, Staffa, Bernera, Davaar etc; which puts those stamps in the status of British Locals. This is another subject of huge controversy also and will be dealt with in the future as documentation has been produced proving status.

On issues with the varieties....at this point establishing what was printed and what exists establishes rarity factor and thus value of the materials in question. We do not ascertain that these varieties are worth large sums of money. At present time for example a single value set of most LOW cars and trains progressive color proofs should retail at around $5.00 U.S.. Wholesale should range $1-2.00. This is nothing really in comparison to the valuation of material being produced by so many countries today. Certain values of these issues should range a bit higher as because of the shall we say horrendous way they were stored, many were destroyed thus increasing rarity considerably. Again...not worth large sums but worth a few dollars more.

We must look at this not only in the straight forward philatelic sense but in the topical collecting sense as well. Topical collectors are here to stay my friends despite the objections of our older generation philatelists and many do not collect them because of their philatelic validity. They like the pictures.

On issues pertaining to what countries were involved:
A good point...the words "the Islands" SHOULD be changed "A group of the islands". Thank you HalfpennyYellow for pointing this out.

On issues about the British Crown Agents. No they were not involved in production of the issues but they WERE made available through various outlets that they were affiliated with. We can possibly change wording on this matter also.

I would like to state I am not a debator. I do not like forums and such generally and am not a member of facebook etc;. I do not have time for it. The project I am working on is huge ( I have been seriously studying and compiling for 15 years) and requires all my time when I am not working or with my family. I found Stampboards.com on my own and took liking to it because it reaches so many. It is basically the only forum I will work with as mostly I just use my site to relay information.

I commend all for the participation and will continue on this thread to post info and try to answer valid questions pertaining to the subject. I have begun process on the St. Lucia issues and will post when the page is complete. It will be the first page showing much more than the Tuvalu side as all varieties were saved. Should be quite colorful.

The Researcher

Er -- nope. What was asked for were examples (preferably on something not obviously contrived) with any operational cancel -- i.e. a cancel actually used because somebody posted a letter from the relevant place with one or more of the stamps on it. Being "postally valid" is a red herring -- the local authorities could cheerfully declare any number of stamps to be valid, so long as there was little risk of them ever going near the place and being used.

The issue isn't whether the stamps technically could have been used, it's whether they ever were. When the only "usages" seen are from a Philatelic Bureau, it's a pretty safe bet that the stamps weren't postally meaningful. Even modern Aussie miniature sheets are occasionally seen with a Castlecrag cancel.

Anybody who has so much contempt for his readers that he makes his website unreadable because of the colour combination deserves the utmost contempt from anybody who stumbles on his site. Your reaction shows supreme arrogance and indifference to those who are visually impaired.

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Ian Billings - Norvic Philatelics GB stamps info: http://www.norphil.co.uk - also /catalog for our ecommerce site, blog.norphil.co.uk, shop.norphil.co.uk and Ian_norvic on twitter

Anybody who is visually impaired has the option of a thing called Internet options/Accessibility dude. Get real. Useless comment.

1. View
2. Style
3. No style

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My wantlist for Malta Revenues

Agreed Mozzerb.
Just saying they were postally valid in the sense that if they (at the time) had access to the stamps and mailed a letter from the islands in question they would have been honored and postally used.

Now that may have entailed getting the stamps in St. Vincent (or wherever) and then going to Bequia and then posting the letter. This is probably why they are all listed in Scott Catalog with numbers. As stated earlier...Scott will not list stamps (with a few small exceptions) unless they were postally valid. This would fall under the U.P.U standards of registering them as such.

The Researcher

You said it!

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Ian Billings - Norvic Philatelics GB stamps info: http://www.norphil.co.uk - also /catalog for our ecommerce site, blog.norphil.co.uk, shop.norphil.co.uk and Ian_norvic on twitter

Browser- and OS-dependent comment.

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Ian Billings - Norvic Philatelics GB stamps info: http://www.norphil.co.uk - also /catalog for our ecommerce site, blog.norphil.co.uk, shop.norphil.co.uk and Ian_norvic on twitter

Obviously one with a chip on the ol shoulder. Probably a Fireflop fanatic.

How about sticking with the subject of the thread?

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My wantlist for Malta Revenues

_________________
Noel Almeida, Night Watchman, Australia Down Under.

They are in line my friend.
Believe I have full documentation on them.

The Researcher

They also have the option of saying "if this person can't be bothered to make their site readable, I can't be bothered to make it readable for them". You want people to read something, don't go out of your way to discourage them ...

Off to work I go.
The site style has been this way for 10+ years. VERY few people complain about it. It seems that the most complainers are on this forum. Get OFF the subject and get ON the subject that the title of this thread is about. any more whiners about the colors on my site will be IGNORED!.

OK, to get back on topic, are you saying that an issue for Nanumea is only valid in Nanumea, or also valid in the rest of Tuvalu?

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My wantlist for Malta Revenues

Unduely negative, everybody (well most, anyway)?

These are not my cup of tea, but the website details are interesting (if a bit garish) & some information is better than nothing at all. I was shown a collection of these in my local a few months back - together with a Royal Wedding/Anniversary ensamble (one of the many). Neither very saleable, but they had nostagic value for the owners.

Cheers, Mike

In the opening post the word "We" appears five times. Who exactly is "we"? This "research" appears to be the work of an individual and not a group. Is it me or am I missing something? Am I over analyzing this?

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Regards, Jay

Ok folks back on for a bit. Working nights and commuting 100 miles one way is a toughy.

We is that several sources and myself are working on the recovery of information and material. I am the writer. A viable question. Many involved in the original sales, production, and closest to the printing company are involved. I do not name names as naming names can involve legal matters which certain individuals may use against us as in slander, liable etc; which we will not allow to happen. Some on this board itself may be the ones who started the rumors 20+ years ago.

Thank you Mike for your comments. Yes, one of the reason for the development of the site is to get the information out to collectors that has never been properly researched. It has been ignored for years and only based on hearsay which in a serious philatelic sense....should not be so.

HalfpennyYellow
Yes they were valid throughout the islands.

Mozzerb
Revealing the results of the research is good business sense as collectors now will have a basis to which to judge value of the material. Agreed that the countries involved do not have a large specialized collecting community. There IS a large involvement on the topical end though.

The lower printrun numbers are in conjunction with just that...supply and demand.
1.) population of the given countries and dependencies is lower.
2.) Collector interest at the time was NOT that large.
Thus as a good business decision....yes it was wise not to print millions thus limiting the issues for future generations which in the end would increase collectibility and as far as the demand sense goes a rise would be imminent as the collecting community grows. Not so much in the serious philatelic sense as in the topical sense. Two completely different markets with ties to each other.

An example the First British Penny Black. 100's are out there being sold for $80.00-$1,000 dollars.Now the question:
If we did not know how many were printed/exist would it not look the same as the LOW trains and cars issues. Perhaps many would look at the Penny Black in the same way. Stating "welll....100's are out there!" "Because of this they MUST be worthless!". Do you see my point? This is why research must be done and finalized if at all possible.

Possibly the talk of rarity might increase demand of people wanting to get in on it. For me it is not a big thing. I do not depend on stamps to support my family and I. It is my hobby and passion of knowledge. I HAVE made discoveries in Egyptian Philatelics. I am a member of the ESC. I do like the prestige of it but do it only in the sense of forwarding the knowledge. I am unbiased as some of my web pages show. Google the inverted Royal Ruby Wedding stamps. Learn the truth about them. Very bad. NOT worth $100's as some would like us to believe. Still...interesting in a sense and a good conversation piece and yes....a valid collectible item. Printed for promotional reasons and demonized by a few greedy dealers out to cheat unknowing collectors out of large sums of money and some still trying to do so today! We know who you are! They are part of the reason for the accusations and slander against the company as a whole.

Hopefully a few questions answered. Out of time. Again I commend those with interest and valid input on this thread. I am sorry that some don't like the look of my site but changing code and everything takes time and thought of which I have little to afford to it at this time. Try creating your own site from scratch writing ALL of the code yourself including shockwave, Java etc; and installing shopping carts and tying with payment systems and on and on and then tell me....when would you have time to research and collect and have a family and work full time?

Here's a couple of covers I have,both came from the St. Vincent Philatelic Service.As you can see one is registered Kingston St. Vincent ,all the stamps on the registered cover are cancelled Port Elizabeth Bequia .

I can't quite make out the cancel on the other cover.



Brian

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Life's too short - spend your money now, or someone else will!!

Researcher,
Just a question about quantities. Were the numbers indicated in the above invoice (1) solely for the use of the Tuvaluan post office; (2) solely for the philatelic distributors; or (3) split between the Tuvalu post office and the philatelic distributors?

I ask, because as a collector of Falkland Islands I saw the following item pictured in November 2011's Gibbons Stamp Monthly:


While this isn't an invoice, Point 3 does clearly says that the quantities printed were for use on the Falklands, and were separate to those to needed for the Bureau (I'm assuming this is Crown Agents), and it does tell us how many stamps were sent to the Falklands for postal use.

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Chris de Haer
Author of 'A Closer Look at Modern Australian Stamps' in Stamp News Australia.
Latest news on my blog http://stamps.chrisdehaer.com.au Follow me on Facebook twitter.com/stampchris

Ditto from me

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Collecting - Stamps, poster stamps and covers that feature Kangaroos.
Wanted: Illustrated Tourist cover of "Waratah Park", Sydney, NSW. Australia