Souvenir Sheets commercially used on Cover

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:17:56 am

I like to collect souvenir sheets used commercially on cover and since joining STAMPBOARDS many members have very kindly obliged by sending various ones to me. So I thought I would start a thread to show Souvenir Sheets that are commercially used on cover. Here's a start:

Thanks Green Go for this recent one:

Ottowa Mike recently sent this fantastic Titanic one:

Teja sent me this one from Slovenia commemorating Radio and Television (along with some nice contents!)

And Teja also send this one:

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:21:59 am

From India sent by Stampboarder drvvr:

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:23:59 am

Commemorating Canada's Coast Guard sent by Ottawa Mike:

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:26:12 am

Ottawa Mike also sent these; one celebrating the Royal wedding and the other of Canada's lilies:

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:32:20 am

john6625 sent this set of the 50 years of the WWF

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:38:24 am

Noggin the Nod sent me this nice SS of HRHQE2 Diamond Jubilee

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:39:38 am

From gurujazz, a nice SS from Spain:

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:41:27 am

AMark sent me this beautiful SS from Canada celebrating the International Year of the Forest:

norvic · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:42:24 am

These are nice covers of miniature sheets commercially used.

Am I correct in saying that only in the US are postally-valid miniature sheets of stamps termed 'souvenir sheets' ? As far as we are concerned in the UK, 'souvenir sheets' are those freebies or cheap souvenirs that one gets from stamp shows or elsewhere.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:43:15 am

AMark also sent this "buggy" one!

Canada stamper · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:46:42 am

norvic wrote:

These are nice covers of miniature sheets commercially used.

Am I correct in saying that only in the US are postally-valid miniature sheets of stamps termed 'souvenir sheets' ? As far as we are concerned in the UK, 'souvenir sheets' are those freebies or cheap souvenirs that one gets from stamp shows or elsewhere.

Canada Post calls them "souvenir sheets" as well.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:50:14 am

norvic wrote:

These are nice covers of miniature sheets commercially used.

Am I correct in saying that only in the US are postally-valid miniature sheets of stamps termed 'souvenir sheets' ? As far as we are concerned in the UK, 'souvenir sheets' are those freebies or cheap souvenirs that one gets from stamp shows or elsewhere.

A mini-sheet for most US collectors is a smaller sheet of stamps....more really a pane of stamps, usually issued as a set of 20. Most stamps come that way today. Souvenir sheets ARE postally valid and are unique in that they are commemorative in nature, usually specifically describe what is being commemorated, and typically have a "picture" theme over the whole sheet. Many times, the stamps on the souvenir sheet are only available as the souvenir sheet but that is not always the case.

As the post offices around the world have become more "artistic," there has been a blending of the souvenir sheet with mini-sheet, to where it is difficult to distinguish between them.

My intent is to show "postally valid" souvenir sheets/mini-sheets. Call them whatever you will in your neck of the woods. But I also want to distinguish them from the standard postal "panes" of stamps that have largely replaced stamp booklets.

Hope that's clear...but you can change the title to souvenir sheets/mini-sheets if you think that would be more clear worldwide.

norvic · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:54:04 am

As you say, the lines have been blurred. Here are two recent sheets from Jersey Post:

I would describe the one on the left as a sheet (as at the PO counter), and the one on the right as a miniature sheet.

Sadly Jersey Post also describes the one on the right as a "Souvenir Miniature Sheet" . This one is described as a Miniature Sheet:

and this one as a sheetlet!

Canada stamper · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:57:04 am

The distinction I usually use is that a "mini-sheet" contains multiples of the same stamp, whereas a "souvenir sheet" contains 1 stamp or 1 of each if there are more. So norvic's left sheet would be a mini-sheet and the one on the right a souvenir sheet.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:57:58 am

This one celebrates India's Coast Guard, from adivaragan:

norvic · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:59:09 am

Canada stamper wrote:

The distinction I usually use is that a "mini-sheet" contains multiples of the same stamp, whereas a "souvenir sheet" contains 1 stamp or 1 of each if there are more. So norvic's left sheet would be a mini-sheet and the one on the right a souvenir sheet.

This is a miniature sheet.....

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 01:59:53 am

Canada stamper wrote:

The distinction I usually use is that a "mini-sheet" contains multiples of the same stamp, whereas a "souvenir sheet" contains 1 stamp or 1 of each if there are more. So norvic's left sheet would be a mini-sheet and the one on the right a souvenir sheet.

Norvic:

I agree with Canada stamper. The one with the multiples of the same stamp is exactly what I was referring to as a "mini-sheet" which has replaced booklets. The one on the right is more akin to a souvenir sheet in our parlance.

Canada stamper · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 02:03:54 am

Another distinction might be that "mini-sheets" or "sheetlets" have the printer information in the selvages, whereas "souvenir sheets" usually do not.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 02:04:21 am

Norvic,

If the term mini-sheet is more comfortable to you, use it. The purpose of my starting the thread WAS NOT to begin a discussion on terms, especially since we are "peoples separated by a common language" as Churchill said. I simply want to show POSTALLY VALID SOUVENIR SHEETS USED ON COVER. Again, if you prefer to use the term mini-sheet feel free.

norvic · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 02:09:05 am

Sorry, I didn't mean to hijack the thread for a discussion on semantics - but at least now we have had that little discussion, google will find the thread whether we search 'miniature sheets on cover' or 'souvenir sheets on cover'

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 02:35:47 am

On e-bay, if you put in the search term "miniature sheet used on cover" you get a different result from "souvenir sheet used on cover", although both searches bring up items that would be of interest to me. The terms are used interchangeably depending on your country of origin. As I said, feel free to change the title to reflect that: Souvenir Sheets/Miniature sheets commercially used on Cover

drh · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 03:52:21 am

Very pretty, but none of them are commercially used. They are all philatelically used, like FDCs.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 04:24:47 am

drh wrote:

Very pretty, but none of them are commercially used. They are all philatelically used, like FDCs.

I strongly disagree. If a cover is sent through the mail, with the correct franking, with a letter or whatever, it's commercially used. Just because it goes to a philatelist DOES NOT make it philatelic, like an FDC is - created for no other purpose than that.

I don't collect FDC's. All the covers I have are addressed with letter enclosed. I want all the covers sent to me to be franked with the correct postage.

But of course, that's my opinion. You're welcome to yours.

Please note: this thread is intended to SHOW souvenir sheets on cover. If you're going to comment, can you at least enrich the experience and purpose of this thread by posting a cover?

In your case, DRH, how about posting one you deem to be "commercially used," versus making a void comment?

AMark · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 04:56:33 am

Timbres,

Nice covers.

I like the Ottawa postmark with the Parliament Building.

Timbres wrote:

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 06:52:44 am

Here's a nice SS on cover from muruk of Australia's Mythical Creatures

Timbres · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 07:41:48 am

This is a nice one recently received in a cover exchange with jamjoe in India:

I hope I can get the matching counterpart of the Mexican joint issue.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 07:45:51 am

Canada Stamper sent this lovely Artic Animals souvenir sheet on cover:

drh · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 08:19:54 am

Timbres wrote:

drh wrote:

Very pretty, but none of them are commercially used. They are all philatelically used, like FDCs.

I strongly disagree. If a cover is sent through the mail, with the correct franking, with a letter or whatever, it's commercially used. Just because it goes to a philatelist DOES NOT make it philatelic, like an FDC is - created for no other purpose than that.

I don't collect FDC's. All the covers I have are addressed with letter enclosed. I want all the covers sent to me to be franked with the correct postage.

But of course, that's my opinion. You're welcome to yours.

Please note: this thread is intended to SHOW souvenir sheets on cover. If you're going to comment, can you at least enrich the experience and purpose of this thread by posting a cover?

In your case, DRH, how about posting one you deem to be "commercially used," versus making a void comment?

Say what you like, it won't change the fact that these 'covers' are all contrived for philatelic purposes.

Canada stamper · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 09:18:37 am

Here's a few I found:

This one came from a collector in Spain:

Canada stamper · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 09:33:51 am

These are recent ones from Delcampe sellers:

This just came in the mail yesterday!

Timbres · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 15:04:45 pm

drh wrote:

Say what you like, it won't change the fact that these 'covers' are all contrived for philatelic purposes.

Say what you like, Your OPINION does not establish fact.

1) ALL these covers have been franked correctly
2) ALL of them fulfilled postal duty for the service paid
3) ALL were posted in their countries of origin and traveled through the international postal service like any other letter.

In your narrow mind, because I'm a collector, that makes them 'contrived'. You probably consider Glen's stamps used to mail his packages as CTO!!!

And of course, we're still waiting for you to post a souvenir sheet used on cover that you deem commercially used (and be sure to explain why too). As it stands now, you'd best toss any cover in your collection addressed to you because based on your ridiculous standards, "it's philatelically contrived"

norvic · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 19:28:11 pm

Mind you don't fall off the high-horse you two!

Timbres, the matter has been discussed at length and the general opinion on the 'Is it philatelic or commercial' thread is that all these would be philatelic on several grounds:

- the stamps/sheets are mostly only bought by collectors rather than joe public;
- they are from one collector to another
- (unless you know otherwise) the postage on some may be overpaid.
- the postage could have been paid by a higher value stamp rather than 16 low value stamps (Spanish cover).

That's not to say they are not very attractive, and I would certainly include the used sheets in my collection. I don't think I would keep the covers; I'd rather have high value stamps on cover, but it is all a matter of personal preference.

GreenGO · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 19:41:05 pm

Hello Timbres.

Good to see that your collection is growing. Congratulations!

You make go and dig into recived mail to find this one:

HalfpennyYellow · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 19:50:19 pm

norvic wrote:

- (unless you know otherwise) the postage on some may be overpaid.

In Malta no miniature sheets can be used with the correct rate unless sent registered. The m/s with the lowest value was €1 (2008), and airmail postage rates up to 20 grams are €0.37 (Europe and N. Africa), €0.51 (N. America, Middle East and Africa), €0.63 (S. America, Asia and Australia) and €0.86 (Pacific region). I don't know how many countries issue miniature sheets which reflect postal rates, the one that comes to mind is Canada (eg. Titanic $1.80) but I'm sure there are more.

Anyway, correct rate or not, they are still nice covers.

norvic · **Posted:** Sun Apr 29, 2012 19:55:39 pm

Likewise there was no £2.76 rate to the USA for which the Diamond Jubilee sheet could have been used alone. However, another 14p would have made it the £2.90 160g packet rate.

Timbres · **Posted:** Mon Apr 30, 2012 03:06:47 am

Norvic,

Yes, you're right. Those would be regarded as "philatelic" since the rate is not correct. But my aim is to receive covers that are correctly franked. As such, they are commercially used in my book. To cast out SS as purely philatelic on the basis that they are SS and the general public doesn't use them is nuts.

But okay. Everyone has the right to collect whatever they want, right? And. I do like them on cover (proves they were commercially used :mrgreen:

)

Rant over. Going back to posting nice SS on cover as I receive them and invite others to do the same!

Canada stamper · **Posted:** Mon Apr 30, 2012 03:10:29 am

norvic wrote:

- the postage could have been paid by a higher value stamp rather than 16 low value stamps (Spanish cover).

Just wanted to point out that only the 4 centre stamps are for postage, the rest are "labels" in the souvenir sheet. I actually hadn't noticed that before...

norvic · **Posted:** Mon Apr 30, 2012 03:13:09 am

Canada stamper wrote:

norvic wrote:

- the postage could have been paid by a higher value stamp rather than 16 low value stamps (Spanish cover).

Just wanted to point out that only the 4 centre stamps are for postage, the rest are "labels" in the souvenir sheet. I actually hadn't noticed that before...

Doh! I hadn't noticed that there were 16 in total with 12 monthly labels around those 4 stamps :-(

Timbres · **Posted:** Tue May 01, 2012 09:20:16 am

Another letter received today from GreenGo with a nice SS. Wondering what the activity pictured is? Salt collecting?

GreenGO · **Posted:** Wed May 02, 2012 06:06:16 am

Hi Timbres.

I see you get my letter, nice.
Yes, on SS above is shown sea salt harvesting in Sečovlje, Slovenia.
Secovlje is one of preservation Nature park in Slovenia.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 11:21:02 am

Another beautiful Souvenir sheet from Slovenia depicting the stork on a stork cachet cover sent by GreenGo. Thank you much GreenGo!

fromdownunder · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 12:29:47 pm

I got this one a couple of days ago.

Postally used? Definately. Philatelic? Definately. Slightly out of date use? Definately. Do I like it? Definately.

Norm

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 15:03:17 pm

Definitely nice Norm!

aethelwulf · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 16:24:39 pm

Timbres wrote:

my aim is to receive covers that are correctly franked. As such, they are commercially used in my book.

Uh-oh, I think on the couple I sent, I left the M/S solo on the front, and the balance of postage I stuck on the reverse. I always delve into my stationery box to find an envelope of a colour that matches with the M/S, then don't clutter the face with the loose stamps that fulfill the postage.

M/S here are usually composed of a set of the basic stamps, which, like the UK, covers the different zones of letter-mail--so there's a domestic, Asia, zone 1 air, zone 2 air. Total $11.80. Registration is $13, and $3 postage for a light letter to N.A. (that's HK $ by the way). If a set of stamps has 6 values, the face comes up to $16.10; then there's the $10 M/S, which feature a single stamp.

So do M/S here serve a "postal need", not really. Are they a way for the PO to make more money ("hey, why sell just a set of 4 stamps to collectors when we can sell 2 sets--1 of sheet stamps, 1 in M/S form"...as Canada is doing nowadays), sure. But M/S do allow for additional design and artwork elements, which is nice.

Timbres · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 16:47:27 pm

I received the two you sent me aethewulf and they are quite nice. Don't worry; I look for the postage paid to be correct. To expect the individual SS to have the exact amount needed would be unreasonable, so the way you did it is fine. In some countries however, all postage must be placed on the address side.

What I dislike is to see mail that is over-franked, merely to get the SS on cover. I would rather see additional postage placed on the piece to get the item to correspond to a correct franking for a higher weight item so usage is correct, or just receive the SS mint. That said, I won't toss any I receive...and thank you very much for what you sent.

What can I send you by return (even if it is something you pass on to the juniors you assist)?

asmodeus · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 18:35:46 pm

Germany Madonna miniature sheet used on the back of cover-normally not allowed

hutch · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 22:40:53 pm

I find all this very confusing! Here is a recent Australian mini-sheet but the postage is too much for the current O/S rate so unless you brought the weight up to the par, it would be invalid or overpaid!

And here is an Australian souvenir sheet! Obviously made for the collector! But if I wanted to postally use these stamps, I am going to have to pay heaps more just to get a current value. Is that really worth it ? ...or am I looking further down the track when MY postally used stamp from a Souvenir Sheet is worth my retirement!

I'm hazarding a guess to say that there is not too many of these sheets postally used! As they were issued with the collector of these sheets in mind, those collectors wouldn't be wanting to break them up too soon either!

but

time will tell!

Anne

drh · **Posted:** Sat May 12, 2012 23:00:48 pm

I'm sure they'll appreciate in value as much as Franklin Mint plates, Star Trek medallions and Elvis Presley porcelain dolls.

hutch · **Posted:** Sun May 13, 2012 01:23:14 am

As I don't collect any of them, I'm sure I'll be safe!!!!

So you think, that individual stamps, postally used, off a souvenir sheet won't be worth anything??

Where are you going to get these stamps if not, off a broken up souvenir sheet!
Postally used...not common!

drh · **Posted:** Sun May 13, 2012 06:25:56 am

Why's everyone concerned about how much they will be worth? If you like em keep em, if not, pass em on.


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