Are collectors of Japan stamps now becoming Extinct??

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by philatarium »

Thanks, Jim. To clarify, the MLOs are stamps of Manchukuo overprinted, not stamps of China overprinted, correct?

(I can see the Alzheimers kicking right in ...)

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by iomoon »

Correct Dave.

They were what the Chinese (Manchurian) PO's had left in their stock after the Japanese had departed. Thus they are remnants and thus were not bountiful. Obviously the Chinese did not want to keep printing the "puppet" stamps.

I collect Volcanos on stamps

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by philatarium »

Thanks, Jim!

My memory is just not as good as it used to be (or so I recall!) ...

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by grantsstamps »

The china overprints of Manchukuo look like these:
Image
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by tommdavies »

Russian/Japanese War Commemoration; I used to have, but cannot now find an A4 size thin paper with a garish watercolour of Japanese troops defeating Russians, and on the reverse a complete set of mint stamps. Does this ring bells?

Tom

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by tommdavies »

My son tells me he now has this commemorative issue. I hope to be able to scan it soon.............. nobody has seen anything like this then?

Great postings. Just re-read them. Really interesting.

Thanks

Tom

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ekaraya »

I have following old issues from Japan and would appreciate some feedbacks/comments from experts:

Image
Image
Image

Thanks and regards,
Ekaraya

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ekaraya »

More old issues from Japan. Your comments/feedback will be appreciated:

Image

Ekaraya

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ligneN »

All forgeries, as stated elsewhere.

cheers
ligneN

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ekaraya »

Thanks again.

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Hi all,

I am a worldwide collector and the earlier stamps of Japan are one of the areas where I have not properly sorted them out.

The Koban issues seem incredibly complex and even trying to use only a semi-specialised reference (Stanley Gibbons) I am finding it very difficult to sort them.

I wondered if anybody had any helpful tips for the novice in this area??

Whilst looking for references I came across this very good site for postmarks:
https://www.sanrizuka.com/koban/

and this site which I literally just found and looks very helpful!
https://web.me.com/renichi1/The_Koban/Welcome.html

This also made me realise the cork style cancels could be allocated to towns which I had not realised.

My collection is quite basic but I thought I would scan a few of the more interesting postmarks etc as I really like socked on the nose postmarks but have not identified any of these. If anybody reads Japanese and can add any information I would be really grateful as the Yokohama one in English is about my limit!

In the second scan the stamp is stuffed but I was intrigued by the Corea postmark. I know some of these issues overprinted were used there, but wondered if unoverprinted stamps were also used again grateful for any information.

Thanks

Lundy :D

Image

Image

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by tonymacg »

Lundy, the postmarks are legible with a bit of an effort - but it would be a kindness to the more elderly members if you could scan the stamps at a rather higher resolution. (Remember: while English has only 26 letters, Chinese (and by extension, Japanese) had around 50,000 characters to call upon :D )
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by pelmen »

Lundy

Along with the SG catalogue I recommend grabbing a copy of the Sakura catalogue and also read up on paper types such as on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postage_stamp_paper. The paper types are probably the most confusing part of indentifying Japanese issues and the proliferation of forgeries (both issues and postmarks) doesn't help either. The Sakura catalogue has a little extra info and some better illustrations so you don't need to be able to read Japanese. It also shows all the issues clearly in colour so its really helpful for finding exactly which series a stamp belongs to, or if its a puppet government issue etc (revenues though aren't represented so for me they go into the "unknown" glassine for further investigation later).

I've finally started to house my Japanese collection into stockbooks and am going through the same confusing process with the early issues. Some of them are easier to deal with than others as there are limited changes of paper and reprints. Pay attention to the size of the design and the colour for each value, this will narrow most issues down to one or two printings. Watermarks will generally get you to the correct printing so you can date which series printing its from. Then you can look closer at the marks, die states and shades etc to pin it down further.

I've been collecting Japan for quite some time and have plenty to house in stockbooks. So I've been going through the SG catalogue which has all the main issues in chronological order (Sakura separates out definitives, commemoratives, national parks, greetings, etc) and I decide how much space to assign to each series in SG. Allowing for variations in perfs/papers/dies etc within a single series and placing a small paper note so I know "these three rows cover issues 234 to 258" or whatever. That way once I'm confident I've narrowed a stamp down to a set I can pop it in the album and move on to the next stamp. As I go through my glassines I'll have lots of each set of the old issues and I'll have room to be able to compare issues side by side and more closely identify each one. If I find I originally mis-identified first time around then I can move the stamp to the appropriate area without having to shuffle anything out of the way.

It also means I can keep many copies of the same issue of the dragons, kobans, birds, etc in my album for closer comparison for forgeries etc as my knowledge grows.

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ligneN »

Postmark/Korea question:

10s blue = telegraph marking of : Fukushima p&t.o. 1886/89
10s brown = non postal dater of Hiroshima 1895
1y = speaks for itself, this foreign mail type used 1894-1906
15s telegraph marking of: Yawatahama p&t.o. 1888/90
25s = non postal dater of Hyogo 1891
10s = non postal dater of Mitajiri (Suo province) 1896
5s ultra = non postal dater of Wakayama 1895
5s brown = "crossroads" mute type of Shanghai IJPA ca. 1876-84
2s olive = double circle dater type KG (general usage 1874/88) of Mishima, Ise province
5s ultra = vertical postal money transfer type of Yujima p.o., 1893 (the verticals were used 1886/1903)
10s = vertical postal money transfer type of ? (not such a common placename, must looked up in a gazetteer) p.o. Tosa province
2s = Inuyama p.o., Owari province of 1894 (is postal = line three in bottom half says "4th delivery"; empty or other = telegraph ec. inner office usages)

If You need translation help re. p.o. names / old provinces / dating, get the ISJP Monograph No. 1 by G. A. Fisher Jr. (http://www.isjp.org).

And if You really want to specialize in koban perfs/papers, I suggest:
Koban colour guide (three vols) by JPS, y.10-15.ooo each
JSCA catalog by JPS, Vol. 1 (1871/1947) period. Preface has details + photographs re. paper varieties.
And learning some basic japanese characters (paper kinds, placenames, numerals).
*
Japan in Korea used overprinted stamps only 1900/01. But non-ovpt. Jap. stamps were accepted as well during the whole period 1876/1945.
-- The ovpt. was meant as a temporary measure against currency speculation in 1900/01
(buy jap stamps with Korean currency and send to Japan = profit).

Regards
ligneN

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by maptrekker »

I hope this is not too a silly a question:

Can a collector identify the locations on old Japanese postmarks using only the reference materials without knowing Japanese?

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Thanks Tony, Pelmen and LigneN,

Apologies for the small scan, I should have scanned them a couple at a time.

Thank you so much for your help, I am not ready to specialise in these at the moment, I am trying to work on Australian KGV heads but really enjoy stamps from all countries.

Early Japanese stamps appear to be another one of those very challenging and rewarding countries to collect and certainly one which I intend to put more effort into and keep my eye out for a reasonably priced Sakura catalogue.

Regarding the postmarks, can I ask one other question, with regards to the non postal dater's and telegraph cancels, should I be trying to avoid these in favour of postal cancels?? With regards to many other countries these are much less collectable is this the case with Japanese stamps?

Thanks again all

Lundy :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by tonymacg »

maptrekker wrote:I hope this is not too a silly a question:

Can a collector identify the locations on old Japanese postmarks using only the reference materials without knowing Japanese?
Possible, but I'm not sure it's feasible.

The characters aren't completely arbitrary: they do have their own internal logic. There are three basic systems of classification: by numbers of brush strokes required to write the character, and the traditional and more modern forms of 'radical' element of the character plus the number of brush strokes required to write the rest of the character.

The first method can be maddening, because it leaves you to search through endless lists of characters.

The second methods require a non-trivial amount of study to recognise the radicals, but it certainly can be done. The traditional radical classification used 214 radicals, although many are quite uncommon. If you were to reach the stage where you could identify what constitutes a brush stroke, and then identify the radicals from the list, you'd be a long way along the path to identifying Japanese (and Chinese and Korean) place names.

It all depends on how much time and effort you're prepared to put into it.
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by maptrekker »

Thanks Tony.

Someone once showed me how he looked up words in a Chinese dictionary. If I remember right, his dictionary was "set up" (if that is the right term) to use radicals to find words.

214 radicals sounds do-able compared to tens of thousands of characters.

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by tonymacg »

I'm told that the Christian missionaries used to be required to learn all 214 radicals. However, many of them are pretty obscure, and can safely be left for later. (Radical 213 is a case in point. My Japanese dictionary, which lists 5446 characters, and Chinese dictionary, which lists 7773 characters, have only only one character under Radical 213 - the radical itself. 'Turtle', in case you're curious :D )

The notes in the back of Nelson's The Modern Reader's Japanese-English Character Dictionary are quite helpful, but I don't know what resources are available online these days. (I did my studies well over 40 years ago.) I'm not sure how successful long distance tutoring by email would be :lol: , but I'd be happy to help.
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ligneN »

Lundy wrote:Thanks Tony, Pelmen and LigneN,

(..)

Early Japanese stamps appear to be another one of those very challenging and rewarding countries to collect and certainly one which I intend to put more effort into and keep my eye out for a reasonably priced Sakura catalogue.

Regarding the postmarks, can I ask one other question, with regards to the non postal dater's and telegraph cancels, should I be trying to avoid these in favour of postal cancels?? With regards to many other countries these are much less collectable is this the case with Japanese stamps?

Thanks again all

Lundy :D
1) Helpfull in any case for a beginner is a bilingual pocket atlas like those published by japanese publisher Kodansha. Available are three pocketbooks by Kodansha, a. whole Japan,
http://img146.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=95653_JapanAtlas_122_355lo.jpg
Japan, a Bilingual Atlas : Nihon Nikakokugo Atorasu (A Kodansha Guide)
b. (more detailed for these particular areas) the Kanto (Tokyo/Yokohama ec.) and b. Kansai (Osaka/Kyoto) regions. - If You are not in the most recent changes of motorways or dept. stores, any elder issue since the 1990s will do it.

2) Postal / "non-postal" is a category deliberately invented by loose-stamp collectors to establish much higher prices for certain odd stamp denominations used with letter mail type daters, not intended for letter mail usage by the posts when issued. By a postal history point of view, it makes no sense at all. Up to 1949, letter&parcel mails plus postal money/telegraph/telephone business and a lot more (life insurance, state bonds...) were all under one roof with the Ministry of Communications.
Postage stamps were used to pay the fees, whether on envelopes or on telegraph- or p.o. box rental-, telephone call bill (inner office) ec. ec. ec.... forms. A lot of stamp denominations were issued solely for "non-postal purposes", viz. the 7s 15s 25s- up denominations.
They occasionally appear on higher weight or foreign mail covers, or after postal rate risings, but usually are scarce thus. Also smaller p.o. often had no "non-postal" daters and simply used the only one stamp device they had. Larger p.o. did as well occasionally (against official rules), as can be verified from entires. Any specialist knows that a 15s koban with a "postal dater" from some 3rd class p.o. was used non-postal anyway.... now how to judge... funny self-created problems.
NOW: its a sport (often a hot-desire) among loose-stamp/"number collectors" to get these odd values used with a domestic-style postal mark, as these are much more rare in comparison. Particular envaluations per issue can be drawn from JSCA (same publisher as Sakura).
One may compare it to the *******MNH feaver of the number collectors vs. a perfectly centered fresh OH copy.
Just fresh ***MNH is not enought, it must be ******* "Metaxa" (greek spirit) MNH. Same appeal to postmarks.

Generally spoken any denomination over 10 sen 1871/1945 with a domestic style dater not identifyable as "postal" generally must be envalued as "non-postal" with merely 20% from the basic catalog value. The top denominations 5y 10y were issued for telephone/telegraph annual payments and are X-seldom seen postally used (parcel mail, air mail ec.).
Now: this invention by the "one copy per cat. number" collectors has lead to a bad image for "non-postal" daters in general.
Most of the average jap. collectors consider them of very inferior and are after the "postal daters". Which I consider rather odd for somebody just collecting "one copy"...

The usual practice of the japanese posts was, after the prescribed storage period for inner-office forms had ended, to scrap these for pulp, but to cut-out/export the pasted stamps. So the ratio postal-non postal daters on kobans in stamp markets outside Japan is even higher.

The end :-) enoy good strikes, take both postal and non postal. Dont pay to much for 90% centrally cancelled (SON) stamps with non-postal daters, they are plentifull: it was much money a 120 years ago, so it was required to cancel them as central as possible. The forms were checked by superiors whether the requirements of defacing high denomination stamps where fullfilled or not. Not so on letter mails.
Otherwise dont bother for the deliberately created definitions invented by the loose-stamp "one piece per catalog number" guys, how one "must" collect used definitives of pre-1949 Japan...
E.g.: among Koban specialists in Japan, the 1888 new koban 25sen 1yen are nicknamed "T"-kobans = telegraph kobans, as they were issued by the posts to replace the small size telegraph stamps of same denominations which were redrawn from the counters in 1888.
The inventors of the "non-postal" thing simply ignore basic postal history facts, i. e. what the posts intended back then. Now waiting years to find a copy used on some heavy parcel with a domestic postal dater is... ridiculous?
A specialized koban-only collector must have all kinds of postmarks on kobans, whether postal, due, FM, telegraph, PMO ec., of course.
But dont join the irritating game of the "Metaxa" MNH 1-copy collectors. :-)

regards
ligneN

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

:D Thanks again LigneN,

Fantastic information, I have learnt lots on this thread and from your fantastic input, I am sure many others also have.

I certainly am not one for playing the "Metaxa" game, MNH does not interest me unless I pick it up for virtually the same as a mounted copy.

The only problem is that the more appreciation you get for issues such as these and other stamps, the less easy it is to settle down and specialise in one country.

Thanks again

Lundy

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by DaveBecker »

Thought I'd add to this post --- been a couple years. I also collect Japan. Mint new issues, and used older issues.

I use White Ace, Scott, and just ordered a Palo album.

Decided to get hingeless because I can't deal with those big mounts.
Collector of used (and some mint) worldwide, Japan, Fr. Poly

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by HKStampsGuru »

Just wondering, given the bulk of issues from Japan recently, does anyone really collect them mint? I mean it must cost a fortune to collect those sheets of 10 (where sometimes it's just 5 stamps repeated twice side by side) and given the high exchange rate of Yen, you really need a deep pocket.
Mint, or used?

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ligneN »

Not since Japan changed its status to "Sheikhdom Japonistan".

But if one omits the Manga, "Kitty", "SF", "pets" ec. hug-the-dumb-youth issues... it still can be done.

Most of the prefectural issues are not of interest either.

Repetition of flowers and local animals - boring.

Just limit to issues of yer like, viz. graphical nice ones like the new year, International-Letter-Writing-Week, "88 shrines", UN-heritage...

Also no small sheets which just show the same stamp in repetition.

I stopped "number collecting" of Japan in 1991 and since then limit to issues whose design I like. Postage dealers, look elsewhere. :mrgreen:

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by philatelist »

I collect Japanese sheets circulated on 1st day of issue, but it's not easy to find collectors from Japan...

If you can help... do let me know! Thanks!
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Hi all,

I wondered, if anybody could help with this postmark?

Image

Thanks

Lundy :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by tonymacg »

It looks like a fiscal use of some kind: the two characters mean 'arrears' or 'unpaid'.
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Thanks Tony,

That helps me put it in the right area of my collection!

Lundy :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ligneN »

Not a "fiscal" marking.

Official postal marking "unpaid" (mino), can be found on stamps ca. 1875-1900. Until ca. 1878, simple brush strokes with red ink are found.

--> Postal usage as due stamp.

As known, Japan never had special due adhesives, but used normal postage stamps as dues on entires until Sept. 30, 1900.

The said marking is used as instructional postmark (= not on stamps) from Oct. 1, 1900 until present.

"Fiscal" markings are very rare on postage stamps. Simply as postage stamps were admitted to use en-lieu solely when stocks of fiscals had run out.

To find postage stamps on fiscal documents is not an easy thing.

Standard fiscal markings are:
- "cancelled"
- "xyz-kind-of fee paid"
- "abc-court/agency fee paid"
- private or company chop

No fiscal marking "unpaid" exists.

4 Sen is probably the most plentifull denomination to be found with due marks.

2 Sen was the domestic letter rate 1873/99, and missing amounts were charged double. "Postage paid by addressee" process was quite common, but there was no specific marking for this before Jan. 1, 1883. So they used the normal unpaid markings for this purpose, too.

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Thanks LigneN,

Great information and very interesting,

I think it is the only one I have but now I know to look out for others.

It was in an old approval book with some other interesting postmarks

Lundy :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by ligneN »

Most due markings are average on japanese pre-1900 stamps, with two exceptions:

- high value stamps (25 Sen and above)
- 1899 Kiku issue: possible 12 months ore less
- 1900 commemorative: 4 months only

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by chalten »

Hello everyone,

Got the attention to the post. I travel once or twice to Tokyo (and sometimes to Osaka) every year but never got around to find stamp shops or markets.

I will be in early September back in tokyo for a couple of days and would appreciate any hint on where to go.

Am I a Japanese collector? No, but like to enjoy my free time in anything not related to my work during travel :-)

Thanks.

best regards,
Martin

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by agondocz »

Hello chalten,

You might want to visit the Philatelic Museum in Tokyo, especially if you are comfortable taking the Yamanote Line.

The staff may be able to help you with finding a stamp dealer.

Best wishes,
AndrewG

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by unechan »

Dear all,

This is unechan from Osaka, Japan, just joined the Board this Sunday.

Although I have started by hobby more than 40 years ago, I was a sort of "accumulator" of all sorts of stamps, and it is only very recent that I started to be more ernest to my hobby… I believe I still am a novice "collector", but as my current interest is classic (19 century) Japanese stamps, stationeries and hand engraved revenues, and as I can read Japanese (… of course), I may contribute to help solve your questions posted here.

I just have had a quick look of the posts in this forum, and it seems that there are many questions regarding the cancellations on classics like Dragon, Sakura (Cherry Blossom) and Old Koban. I hope that can contribute to this field, especially on the consistency of cancellations/stamp combination, which often can be used to eliminate the forgeries.

Happy collecting !
unechan / Osaka, Japan
Collecting Japanese stamps, stationeries from Meiji era and hand engraved revenues

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Machaggis52 »

Philafan1 wrote:Thank you all for your responses!!
I knew they were somewhere...
:)
And thank you to for receiveing me in this great place,
(I promise I will improve my english!)
I wouldn't worry about your English. It is better than our Japanese. :D
With kind regards, Jim

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Lundy
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Welcome Unechan,

Thanks for the offer of help hope you enjoy the site, I will have to scan some of my recent Japanese items

Lundy :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by S Wilson »

... I have visited beautiful Japan many times.
The "National Park" series are my favourites, and I have almost completed these.
I also like the Ashinoko Air Mail stamp series.
One day I hope to purchase the 1934 "Communications Day Souvenir Sheet".

For now, I have attached the first few issues of the National Park Series in my collection.
Also a strange stamp that I have not been able to identify. Perhaps a variation on the "Tobacco revenue" stamp that was mentioned earlier in the post. I wonder how these "Tobacco Revenue" stamps were used ?. Was each stamp applied to a cigarette carton, or to a purchase order ???? :?

S Wilson

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Image

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by patg »

Welcome unechan:
This is nothing so interesting as the classics, but I was wondering if you would provide a translation as to their purpose.

As a kid, I had spent a few years in Yokosuka (1961). I was fairly new to collecting at the time, and had found a shop not too far outside the base. Nice old guy ran it (Him no English - me no Japanese), he managed to patiently put up with me, and steered me towards what I could afford; which was not much on 50¢ a week (at the time ¥360=$1) allowance.

Anyway, one day he put these in my sack with the others. For some years I treated them like the real deal :D, but eventually wised up. Issued in 1948 & 1949 they are $500 & $600 in Scott :lol:

So after all these years, I'm finally getting around to asking someone: stamp shop ad, stamp show, "Eat at Joe's Diner".....??

Image

Image


Thanks & best wishes,
patg
:D "I don't have a lot - But I like what I got" :D

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unechan
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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by unechan »

S Wilson wrote:... I have visited beautiful Japan many times.
The "National Park" series are my favourites, and I have almost completed these.
I also like the Ashinoko Air Mail stamp series.
One day I hope to purchase the 1934 "Communications Day Souvenir Sheet".

For now, I have attached the first few issues of the National Park Series in my collection.
Also a strange stamp that I have not been able to identify. Perhaps a variation on the "Tobacco revenue" stamp that was mentioned earlier in the post. I wonder how these "Tobacco Revenue" stamps were used ?. Was each stamp applied to a cigarette carton, or to a purchase order ???? :?

S Wilson

Image
Image
Dear S Wilson,
The "strange stamp" is Tobacco revenue, 2 sen, imperforate. This series was issued in 1883. You can also find the perforated ones issued later (perf 9-10 [at] 1884, perf 12-13 [at] 1892). These tobacco revenue stamps were used to seal the boxes, paper wraps, paper wrapped boxes and bundles; see the attached image taken from Proclamation No.150. Meiji 8 (1875) where the tobacco taxation has been announced.

Image

Image

The taxation system depends on the weight of the product and the quality (i.e. wholesale price per weight of 100 "mom"; 1 mom = 3.75g), which resulted to issuance of revenue stamps with many different face values. This 2 sen revenue is for tobacco package weighing between 30 "mom" and 50 "mom", and its wholesale price per 100 "mom" between 25 and 50 sen.

Hope this helps you !
unechan / Osaka, Japan
Collecting Japanese stamps, stationeries from Meiji era and hand engraved revenues

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by unechan »

patg wrote:Welcome unechan:
This is nothing so interesting as the classics, but I was wondering if you would provide a translation as to their purpose.

As a kid, I had spent a few years in Yokosuka (1961). I was fairly new to collecting at the time, and had found a shop not too far outside the base. Nice old guy ran it (Him no English - me no Japanese), he managed to patiently put up with me, and steered me towards what I could afford; which was not much on 50¢ a week (at the time ¥360=$1) allowance.

Anyway, one day he put these in my sack with the others. For some years I treated them like the real deal :D, but eventually wised up. Issued in 1948 & 1949 they are $500 & $600 in Scott :lol:

So after all these years, I'm finally getting around to asking someone: stamp shop ad, stamp show, "Eat at Joe's Diner".....??

Image

Image


Thanks & best wishes,
patg
Dear patg, thank you for the warm welcome. 60's and 70's were the good old days of stamp collecting "boom" in Japan, and it is nice to hear that you have spent your childhood then in Japan !

The miniature sheets are of course replicas. On the back is "San-Ko-Hin" (specimen for reference, reference material). The name of the printer (bottom right) are not clearly readable, but is not of the government; there exists other versions which is printed by "(Japan) stamp dealer association".

Image

Thus I suspect that these replica sheets were used as offer gifts by the stamp dealer at that time, exactly what you have experienced in the small stamp shop in Yokohama.

Although they are not genuine, I believe they are real treasures of your good memory from your childhood :-)
unechan / Osaka, Japan
Collecting Japanese stamps, stationeries from Meiji era and hand engraved revenues

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by patg »

unechan,
Thank you for your help.
I enjoy having them, and they do bring back good memories of the time I spent there.

patg
:D "I don't have a lot - But I like what I got" :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Hi all,

This is a postmark query on a Japanese stamp I picked up,

It is a French paquebot? Postmark Ligne N Paq. Fr. No.10. My question is, does anybody know anything else about this eg where it was used etc?

Image

Apologies for the toning it needs a hot bath :D

Thanks all

Lundy :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by HayeSmyth »

Lundy wrote:Hi all,

This is a postmark query on a Japanese stamp I picked up,

It is a French paquebot? Postmark Ligne N Paq. Fr. No.10. My question is, does anybody know anything else about this eg where it was used etc?

Lundy :D
This was used on ships of the Messageries Imperiales set up in 1862 and was first known as the 'Ligne d'Indo-Chine' going as far as Saigon. This became 'Ligne N' in 1866. The service was extended to Shanghai in 1868 and to Yokohama in 1889. Your strike looks like a Type F.

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by Lundy »

Thanks HayeSmyth,

Great to have the information behind the cancel, I will add a nite to it in my collection :D

Lundy :D

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by agondocz »

Kitty-chan and her family and friends from 2013:
Image
I wonder if these stamps are too "kawaii" or too cute to use on cover...

Best wishes,
AndrewG

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by S Wilson »

Hi Unechan

Thank you very much for your detailed description of the application of the tobacco stamp.
Sumimasen for my belated reply, but I have just come back from Christmas / New Year holidays.
During the holidays I stayed away from the Internet and spent some "old fashioned" family time with my parents and my brothers and sisters.

I hope you also had a relaxing New Year :D

S Wilson

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by March »

Japan's first stamps , Dragons 1871

Image

Are these genuine stamps or the masterpiece forgeries of HIROSE or Kotaro WADA ?!?

Thanks

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by unechan »

March wrote:Japan's first stamps , Dragons 1871

Image

Are these genuine stamps or the masterpiece forgeries of HIROSE or Kotaro WADA ?!?

Thanks
Although I am not an expert in dragon issues, I would say they are very likely to be forgeries; exceptionally too wide margins, rather odd typefaces of value inscriptions (this is hard to explain, but they just look odd !), unusual cancellations… 48 mon likely to be Spiro, 100 mon likely to be Hirose (at least not Wada), 200 mon and 500 mon likely to be Wada, but before making this sort of decision, I would be happy to hear other specialist like LigneN's opinion to this observation !

FYI, the dragon issues have "secret marks" to avoid counterfeiting, so comparing the detailed design with the genuine issues would help to identify forgeries.

I also recommend having a look at these wonderful Web pages, with images of genuine stamps as well as major forgeries.

https://www.geocities.co.jp/HeartLand-Renge/1164/dragon_48mon.htm
https://www.geocities.co.jp/HeartLand-Renge/1164/dragon_100mon.htm
https://www.geocities.co.jp/HeartLand-Renge/1164/dragon_200mon.htm
https://www.geocities.co.jp/HeartLand-Renge/1164/dragon_500mon.htm

Regards,
unechan / Osaka, Japan
Collecting Japanese stamps, stationeries from Meiji era and hand engraved revenues

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by March »

Thank you unechan

Very useful the links you provided to us.

So basis these links here are my comments :

- 48 mon : missing the secret marks. Most likely is a Wada A forgery
- 100 mon : missing the secret marks. However when I compare it with forgeries examples none of them matches ! Because the last black vertical sign ( letter/figure) is different from those of originals and forgeries !!!
- 200 mon : the worst forgery among all ! It could be Wada B or Spiro.
- 400 mon : forgery of Plate I , early printing. Secret marks missing ! I guess is Wada A or Wada C .

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Re: Japan collectors are in extinction?

Post by unechan »

Dear March,

I forgot to mention that the 100 mon stamp image is upside down :shock:

Turn the image 180 degrees, and the value inscription characters do have similar characteristics as those of Hirose (especially Hirose B) shown in the URLs. The rather wide spacings between the three characters seems to be unique to Hirose, and this matches your stamp.

Regards,

-- Hironobu
unechan / Osaka, Japan
Collecting Japanese stamps, stationeries from Meiji era and hand engraved revenues

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