South Australia: "Squared Circle" Stamp Postmarks discussion

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 26 Nov 2007 12:39

GraniteSA wrote:Its the books illustration overlayed on gregs stamp

Nice! How do you do that?

Greg

GraniteSA · Post by **GraniteSA** » 26 Nov 2007 12:42

PC 23-12-1905
1 in adelaide collection 17-10-1908

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 26 Nov 2007 12:44

One in SI's collection 1909.

Greg

GraniteSA · Post by **GraniteSA** » 26 Nov 2007 12:48

grrrr more changes

GraniteSA · Post by **GraniteSA** » 26 Nov 2007 12:50

make one of the scans transparent, copy and paste it on top.
My favourite program is iphoto express but any photo shop type prog should do it

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 09 Dec 2007 13:53

Following are 2 squared circle cancellations (+ 1 cds) fron SA.
Whilst I have most info for WA, South Australia is new to me.
Can anyone tell me scarcity plus any other relevent details of these for me:

1. Alberton Railway Station, reversed 4 index.
1A. Alberton index 3.

2.St Peters, index 3.

and 3. Tarowie Railway cds.

Thanks inadvance for any info!

Cheers.
Browny.

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 09 Dec 2007 14:38

First card: Alberton Type 1, code looks to be 3-. I believe the code 3 in my collection is (or was, until now) the only known one. So if it is simply code 3, you have the second known strike of it. Code 3- is unrecorded. Not a bad start.

Alberton Railway Station, type 1, code 4 (reversed). In Overton, the most recent book on these things, code 4 is unreported. However I know of four copies -- but none of them are reversed. And all the known code 4s are from 1893 -- yours is 1896. What a showpiece of a card!

Second card: St. Peters, type 2, code 3. Type 2 was only used for 2 years -- 1894 and 95. Yours is very close to the earliest recorded date, and may in fact be the ERD. Another quite scarce one. I don't have code 3 in my collection, which suggests that it isn't easy to find.

Third card: Terowie squared circle with corners removed. Really common, though it seems to have a code number, which is not known on these. The Terowie Railway cancel isn't a squared circle, and isn't hard to find. Gang 6 is also quite easy to find.

Greg

kris · Post by **kris** » 09 Dec 2007 14:48

my first attempt at photobucket and adding scan here so hope works

my only squared circle on a roo, probably not rare but thought Id join in the fun here...

http://s275.photobucket.com/albums/jj304/kestamps/?action=view&current=roosquaredcircle.jpg

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 09 Dec 2007 14:51

All I can see of the town name of that one is "E". I'm good at identifying partial postmarks, but I'm not that good.

Greg

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 10 Dec 2007 12:07

Hi Greg,
WOW

have to be lucky sometimes!

Can confirm that the Alberton is definitely code 3-

I'm at work at moment, and will check on the index within the Terowie cds and confirm if ink blotch or other for you.

Thanks for the info....

Regards.
Browny.

Post by **ozstamps** » 10 Dec 2007 13:25

kris wrote:my first attempt at photobucket and adding scan here so hope works

my only squared circle on a roo, probably not rare but thought Id join in the fun here...

https://stampboards.com/images/kestamps/?action=view&current=roosquaredcircle.jpg

kris .. you are selcting the wrong link from photobucket to post here.

Take the one that says is for use on Bulletin Boards - the final one, headed IMG CODE .. that has the "IMG" html coding already added to front and back.

It will give you THIS!

Glen

waroff49 · Post by **waroff49** » 10 Dec 2007 21:54

I dislike this thread. Just when I was about to go out and do some gardening, I read it and that was the end. I spent about 2 hours looking at my SA stamps trying to find some squared circles with town names that I could read (apart from Adelaide). Found a few with indistinct/partial strikes.

Not expert enough to decipher some of the towns.

Post by **GlenStephens** » 10 Dec 2007 22:21

waroff49 wrote:
Found a few with indistinct/partial strikes.

Not expert enough to decipher some of the towns.[/b]

I bet Greg would be pleased to try.

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 10 Dec 2007 23:57

Hi Greg,
Regarding the Terowie cds, I've inclded an image below using the USB scope, showing what I believe/think to be an inverted 3 index. (code).
What do you reckon?

(Height of numeral is 2.5mm,which is the same as the others within the cds. It's missing the 0 year plug from the normal 02, as was common within WA at least!)

negative image:

waroff49 · Post by **waroff49** » 11 Dec 2007 00:20

Looks like I'll have to get the scanner warmed up. More hours tomorrow. How will I ever get the garden done?

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 11 Dec 2007 00:21

G'day Greg,
Here's the scan of the ...NN that I emailed you about:

Cheers.
Browny.

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 11 Dec 2007 02:24

Pretty sure it is Glynn -- will check what that one looks like when I get home.

And I can't be sure what the Terowie code # is.

Greg

GraniteSA · Post by **GraniteSA** » 11 Dec 2007 12:45

Greetings

Alberton Railway Station SC2 - R (25-50)
Alberton SC1 - C (Lots)

Saint Peters looks more like SC1 (probably R) which makes yours LRD - will investigate further.
SC1 arcs close to frame 24mm
SC2 arcs away from frame 23mm

Terowie Railway F1 - C gangs 3,6,8 known

I'll defer to Greg re: indices.

NN can't be Glynn lettering too small.
The NN is in the middle of the name but I cant match it to anything

Parabba SC on pcard sold for $A1210

Post by **ozstamps** » 11 Dec 2007 12:52

Name looks longer than Mannum

GraniteSA · Post by **GraniteSA** » 11 Dec 2007 13:19

Mannum
Large letters directly above SA

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 11 Dec 2007 13:30

Thanks, Neville. Turns out I had St Peters types 1 and 2 transposed -- now fixed. And I discovered a type 2 time code 4 in the process. (If that is card definitely type 1, it is also the discovery copy of time code 3, no?)

The NN can be Athenna, Balhannah, Binnum, Hermannsberg, Innaminka, Joanna, Kilkenny, Killalpaninna, Mannahill, Mannanarie, Mannum, Ninnes, Penneshaw, Pinnaroo, Port Macdonnell, Tidnacoordooninna, Watchannie, or Yudnapaninna.

Taking out the ones where the double N isn't in the second half of the name, we're left with Athenna, Balhannah, Hermannsberg, Joanna, Kilkenny, Killalpaninna, Port Macdonnell, Tidnacoordooninna, Watchannie, Winnecke, or Yudnapaninna.

Here's a scan of the St Peters Type 2 code 4, Glynn (with a lovely strike of the postmaster's thumbprint), and Balhannah, one of the more promising NN candidates (but likely the wrong one -- it is last known used in 1908). And you can see Killalpaninna just to my left.

Greg

kris · Post by **kris** » 11 Dec 2007 14:00

apologies if these are boring/common examples but Im enjoying reading this thread/checking out the scans and learning what I can.
two squared circle (even I can make out Mintaro) and another for good measure

all the best

GraniteSA · Post by **GraniteSA** » 11 Dec 2007 14:09

Mintaro Central SC1 1889 to 1907
Probably Lucindale 1896 to 1912 26mm
or Yarandale 1904 to 1909 27mm

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 11 Dec 2007 14:49

Wow, that's a tough call!

My vote is Lucindale. Look where the last line in the N points.

Greg

Post by **ozstamps** » 11 Dec 2007 14:52

Toss a coin on those two!

kris · Post by **kris** » 11 Dec 2007 14:53

you folks are quick! cheers
call it - heads or tails?

Browny · Post by **Browny** » 11 Dec 2007 16:46

Hi Greg & Granite SA,
Regarding the NN, are any of the locality probables you've listed, known with a code 2??

G'day also to you Kris and Bill

kris · Post by **kris** » 11 Dec 2007 18:59

G'day Browny

posted some stuff to you today - hope you enjoy!
all the best
Kris

Seapaw · Post by **Seapaw** » 11 Dec 2007 22:18

Hi,

As others have commented this has been a very fascinating thread. After reading this I also went through my albums looking for square circle cancels - and found a few. Some I could make out, others probably left to those with a more discerning eye - hence my post. I would be interested in some help with these below.

I also have these five cancels as well, all quite clear but wonder to their rating as rare or not (or simply nice looking!!)

crosscrescent · Post by **crosscrescent** » 11 Dec 2007 22:54

Seapaw,

Thanks for showing this scan of stamps with squared cancellations. Have been enjoying following this thread.

Cheers
Andrew

kris · Post by **kris** » 11 Dec 2007 23:08

yep, has been an interesting subject with some great scans - and a good one to make everyone have another look through the collection...

just found these two (almost twins) KGVs with Owen...

Post by **ozstamps** » 19 Dec 2007 22:04

From stock. This must rate as the MOST ads on any Advertising Envelope from anywhere! ELEVEN ads!

March 21, 1901 -- superb strike of the Adelaide Reg'd Squared Circle - to Tattersalls Tasmania - Registered post.

This is a very early COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA cover of course as the Federal Postmaster General's Department was not established until March 1, 1901.

Lovely advertising reverse with those 11 ads, and a Hobart March 26, 1901 arrival "thimble'.

Glen

pres · Post by **pres** » 20 Dec 2007 21:48

What a beaut cover with all that advertising on it. And the Three Pence stamp on cover is not easy to find either.

Never mind the spike hole, a very attractive item.

Kev · Post by **Kev** » 20 Dec 2007 22:01

pres wrote:What a beaut cover with all that advertising on it. And the Three Pence stamp on cover is not easy to find either.

Never mind the spike hole, a very attractive item.

I use a spike for my receipts etc so that my bride of many years does not need to hunt too much when the bills roll in - but I had to look hard to find this one just north of the "A" in Adams! I guess I'm right?
Cheers, Kev.

Post by **ozstamps** » 20 Dec 2007 22:11

pres wrote:What a beaut cover with all that advertising on it.

And the Three Pence stamp on cover is not easy to find either.

Never mind the spike hole, a very attractive item.

Tony, yes in my experience about 95% of all Tatts covers have a central filing spike.

As noted, luckily this one is virtually undetectable and has been neatly repaired.

This one was one of Ray Kelly's famous advertising covers collection, and was offered at auction for $250.

http://www.prestigephilately.com/catlot.php?acode=231417&auctionnum=123&sortcode=kelly&lim=

I just sold it to a member here for $85!

Glen

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 21 Dec 2007 00:39

I hope the buyer notices that the 3d stamp has a dot before the P in POSTAGE, which is a constant variety.

Greg

Post by **ozstamps** » 21 Dec 2007 00:42

Greg .. you'll make his day!

I was too lazy to look up the auction price before I named my price.

I would not have seen that plate flaw in a million years.

He likes flaws .. we'll get him onto SA yet.

dm57 · Post by **dm57** » 21 Dec 2007 00:52

Hi .......Is there any update as to when the book may be available for purchase

Dieter

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 21 Dec 2007 02:24

By the way, I haven't forgotten Seapaw's scans. Haven't found the time to go through them and identify them.

Greg

Didge · Post by **Didge** » 21 Dec 2007 07:43

Folks,

I am the lucky purchasser of the cover Glen has posted.

I was interested in it because of the date of use being close to federation.

I dont have any knowledge of SA items at all.

I could get interested though having read some of the posts here.

Mildura is nearly SA but not quite.

Tim

Kev · Post by **Kev** » 21 Dec 2007 09:38

Greg Ioannou wrote:I hope the buyer notices that the 3d stamp has a dot before the P in POSTAGE, which is a constant variety.

Greg

G'day Greg,

I can see the dot and would be interested in knowing your reference.

It is not listed in "Australian States Specialists Catalogue" I bought from Glen S. quite recently.

Cheers, Kev, Sydney, OZ.

Greg Ioannou · Post by **Greg Ioannou** » 21 Dec 2007 09:41

No reference. I saw a collection of these at some show (perhaps Capex?) and remember some of the constant varieties on display. I've never seen them written up.

Greg

Kev · Post by **Kev** » 21 Dec 2007 09:57

Greg Ioannou wrote:No reference. I saw a collection of these at some show (perhaps Capex?) and remember some of the constant varieties on display. I've never seen them written up.

Greg

Thanks Greg,
I wonder if anyone knows of a reference?
Cheers, Kev.

pres · Post by **pres** » 21 Dec 2007 10:13

Dieter,
The book release date is still late 2008, but a lot more information has come to light recently and working through that may delay it a bit, not too much I hope

pres · Post by **pres** » 21 Dec 2007 10:22

There is no reference to that flaw.

The SA collectors of the time wasted much of their time fooling around with the supposed myriad of perforation varieties not realising that they came from only two machines, one perf 10 and the other perf 11.5 varying to 12.5.

The early SA collectors also did not bother with such things as printing flaws, only the stamps themselves, which is why we are now having so much work to do.

Virtually nothing was done on research into the De la Rue small stamps and to make the book as complete as possible we are now having to do that work over 100 years later and with very scant records available to us.

Didge · Post by **Didge** » 21 Dec 2007 10:30

Folks,

Could anyone elaborate on the significance of the constant variety of the dot before the p on the 3d cover? I would like to make a note of it in my collection and dont have any idea of the significance of the variety.

Thanks,

Tim

pres · Post by **pres** » 21 Dec 2007 20:22

That dot flaw probably only occurs once on a sheet and is possibly from the plate making process.

I'm not up in the actual process so maybe a printer among us might be able to better describe how it happened.

I have 14 of that stamp and none of them have the dot flaw.

The total print run for the stamp was 432,000 or 1,800 sheets, so at one flaw per sheet there could only ever be 1,800 of them and with a suggested survival rate of 5% that means probably 90 examples remain.

To my knowledge the issue has never been plated and probably never will be because there are no large multiples or part sheets and as I noted earlier, the old time collectors of these stamps never bothered about such things.

Unless a plating can be done I would not place much importance on the flaw, but it is interesting and will be noted in the book.

dm57 · Post by **dm57** » 21 Dec 2007 23:45

pres wrote:Dieter,
The book release date is still late 2008, but a lot more information has come to light recently and working through that may delay it a bit, not too much I hope

Thank you.....it will be worth the wait I'm sure....looks like next years Xmas present is decided.

kris · Post by **kris** » 01 Feb 2008 10:36

interesting topic so thought Id bump it up with a couple of scans

Kadina SQ on Newspaper Wrapper

another 2 - first one is Carrieton not sure on other...

any info on ratings etc would be greatly appreciated as my knowledge on this topic is still minor - Im looking forward to the release of Tony's book

kris · Post by **kris** » 01 Feb 2008 11:30

heres some Eudunda SQ cancels on a postcard, with bonus Parede - Portugal cancel

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