The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Global Administrator »

emason wrote:
17 Apr 2021 06:28
Another view of the Manchester 'fishtail' mx.

Image

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Yes that almost ''V'' shape of the loop really stands out now Bill mentions that. :lol:
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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by CMJ »


As some of you may know, one of my "obsessions" is the transition between using red and black ink to apply the Maltese cross obliterator in February 1841. As there wasn't a single transition date for this change, I like to obtain covers which narrow down the changeover date at individual Post Towns and a few have been added recently.

These two covers confirm that Leeds made the change between 14 and 18 February 1841.

C1506F.jpg
Leeds to Sheffield, dated 13 February 1841
1d black (plate 6) cancelled with a red Maltese cross



C1507F.jpg
Leeds to Blackburn, dated 18 February 1841
1d black (plate 9) cancelled with a black Maltese cross



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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by CMJ »



These two covers confirm that Monmouth made the change between 12 and 17 February 1841.

C1531F.jpg
Monmouth to Ross, dated 11 February 1841
1d black (plate 6) cancelled with a red Maltese cross



C1530F.jpg
Monmouth to London, dated 17 February 1841
1d black (plate 9) cancelled with a black Maltese cross



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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

CMJ - love the transitional covers and both the pairs of Monmouth and Leeds are spectacular. A few of my covers are transitional but more by luck than judgement!

A far more ordinary cover below, but one that caught my eye...

6Leeds.jpeg

1d Red from London to Leeds, dated 1 December 1843, cancelled first in London by a No 6 in cross and then again on arrival in Leeds by an additional Maltese Cross, presumably as the adhesive wasnt considered sufficiently obliterated.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

A couple of examples of the olive Maltese Cross of Watton, both where the ink colour matches the undated circle.

Watton2.jpeg

1d Red sent from Watton to Dereham, dated 10 November 1841, cancelled by an olive-brown maltese cross.

Watton1.jpeg

1d Red sent from Watton to Dereham, dated 14 October 1841, cancelled by an olive-brown maltese cross.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Global Administrator »

CMJ wrote:
18 Apr 2021 22:15

As some of you may know, one of my "obsessions" is the transition between using red and black ink to apply the Maltese cross obliterator in February 1841. As there wasn't a single transition date for this change, I like to obtain covers which narrow down the changeover date at individual Post Towns and a few have been added recently.

These two covers confirm that Leeds made the change between 14 and 18 February 1841.

Image
Leeds to Sheffield, dated 13 February 1841
1d black (plate 6) cancelled with a red Maltese cross



Image
Leeds to Blackburn, dated 18 February 1841
1d black (plate 9) cancelled with a black Maltese cross



So even larger offices like Leeds would only have ONE counter ink pad it seems?

Glen
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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by chipg »

Badu wrote:
13 Mar 2021 00:47
chipg wrote:
18 Jul 2020 07:05
Badu wrote:
18 Jul 2020 05:07
Some nice examples there! I've been searching my collection for an example lettered CG and couldnt find one. Then I realised who must own them all! :shock:
I think that there are a few people attempting plate reconstructions who curse me on a daily basis.
I finally managed to get one! :lol: :lol:


Image


6 single 1d Reds placed as a block (all plate 25) including the elusive CG check letters, sent from Barnsley to London, dated 8 October 18424 and cancelled by 10 strikes of an under-inked black Maltese Cross.
Didn't realize just how long it's been since I checked this board. Congrats on this find. You tracked down a unicorn. Enjoy its rarity - likely will be fleeting once my heirs decide to dispose of my collection. (And the way things are going, if my wife finds out what I'm spending on stamps, my death may be greatly accelerated).

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by angelal »

Good morning all

I have what I believe to be a purple cross on cover and would welcome your thoughts as if I have done the correct thing in buying this? I have attached photos.

I have checked other violet crosses on line and this appears to be sound in terms of colour - it appears to be sent form Lanark and I am aware of violet crosses from the Glasgow area.

Many thanks
Angelal

Purpleple cross fron.jpg
.
Close up of stamp.jpg
.
Postage labels including Lankark.jpg
.
close up of Lanark and one other.jpg
[/AddSpace]

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by CMJ »


Alastair,

From the markings on the reverse:

Lanark boxed datestamp
Carlisle transit datestamp
Newcastle upon Tyne arrival datestamp

whilst it is difficult to be sure from the scans, the dates appear to be 28/29 June 1843, so the route of this letter is established - and it is the expected one.

Lanark was a Post town in its own right and whilst "close" to Glasgow (25 miles) there was no reason for southbound mail to go anywhere near it. If it had, there would have also been a Glasgow datestamp applied in transit.

The Purple/violet (and shades) crosses are only associated with local Penny Posts from the immediate Glasgow area and were applied at the local receiving houses. They almost always occur with a numbered receiving house mark in the same shade as the cross.

Lanark itself isn't recorded as having used this colour of ink.

Personally, I don't think it is genuine, but I haven't seen it in the "flesh". The only way to be certain is to send it to a competent authority (such as Mike Jackson) for an opinion.

Sorry for the potentially bad news.

Chris.


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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by angelal »

Chris,

Thank you so much I am returning the cover for a refund.

Alastair

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by admin »

.
Can the MX whizzes here please advise if there is anything distinctive about this red MX?



image0-0097.jpg




The 1d Black plating gurus have ID'd this as plate 10 - www.tinyurl.com/1dPlate10 - and as is known, Red MX on Plate 10 is pretty unusual and rather scarce, that late in the day.

About to list it up at a reasonable price, and just wondered if I might be double lucky and find it is a slightly better MX, or a late use of a more common one?

Thanks in advance!

Glen
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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

admin wrote:
16 Jul 2021 13:09
About to list it up at a reasonable price, and just wondered if I might be double lucky and find it is a slightly better MX, or a late use of a more common one?

Looks like a common MX to me, sorry! (though appreciate I'm a little late on that one!)

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

Picked up the following recently:

1dBlackTudorRose.jpeg

1d Black (plate 1b) with 2 strikes of the Maltese Cross showing a "tudor rose" like pattern. Still searching for an example on cover in red ink though!

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Rog »

Very attractive 8-)

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

Wimborne.jpeg

1d Red sent from London to Wimborne, dated 27 Jan 1844, cancelled by a London No. 3 in cross. A Wimborne datestamp with the wrong date then cancelled out by a Maltese Cross at Wimborne and the correct date applied above.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

Perth3.jpeg

1d Red (Plate 21) sent from Stanley to Perth, dated 1 April 1843, cancelled by 3 strikes of the Perth Maltese Cross as well as a 4 pointed star (in grey ink) associated with the Stanley receiving office.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

DevonportPink.jpeg

1d Black (plate 2) sent from Devonport to Plymouth, dated 28 Jan 1841, cancelled by 2 strikes of a pinkish-red Maltese Cross. The cds is missing a 2, though the letter is dated 27 Jan.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

1dBlackRedirected1dRed.jpeg

1d Black (plate 4) sent from Grantown to Cullen, dated 24 May 1841, arriving on 27 May 1841, subsequently forwarded on 28 May 1841 to Edinburgh with the additional fee paid by a 1d Red (plate 9)

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

BlackGrey1dRed.jpeg

1d Red, sent from London to Edinburgh, dated 28 September 1842, cancelled with a London Inland Office black Maltese Cross then redirected to Glasgow and cancelled with a grey Edinburgh Maltese Cross on 30 September. Unusually, no fee apparently charged for this redirection.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by CMJ »


Lovely examples, Badu :D :D

Is it possible that the last one of this batch (London to Edinburgh to Glasgow) wasn't a redirection in the normal sense (i.e. upon/after delivery requiring additional postage) but a correction to the address by the Post Office in Edinburgh who realised that it had been incorrectly addressed and should be sent to "Cathcart House, near Glasgow" ?

That wouldn't have attracted an additional charge.

Chris.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by MrBeagle »

In line with what Chris writes, I think the original author of the message might have realized his mistake and made the correction himself. Compare the "G" and "s" in Glasgow with those letters in the address. Furthermore, are the two MX strikes different? or the same with perhaps an hit on the inkpad in between?
Ralph

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

BlackGrey1dRedRear.jpeg

Cheers for the thoughts both. Scan of the rear which should help. I think from this its pretty clear that it went London (28/9) -> Edinburgh (30/9) -> Glasgow (1/10).

I think that CMJs explanation that it could well have been corrected by the Post Office in Edinburgh fits well, particularly as the recipient Lord Greenock was presumably well known, which accounts for the lack of redirection fee.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by asmodeus »

Could this be a Maltese Cross of Coventry?
img290.jpg
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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by emason »

asmodeus wrote:
21 Sep 2021 16:41
Could this be a Maltese Cross of Coventry?

Image
It looks like it to me.
Compare it with these.

COVENTRY MX.jpg


The poor strike and watery ink are typical of Coventry.
Best wishes,
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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by asmodeus »

emason wrote:
22 Sep 2021 05:38
asmodeus wrote:
21 Sep 2021 16:41
Could this be a Maltese Cross of Coventry?

Image
It looks like it to me.
Compare it with these.

Image


The poor strike and watery ink are typical of Coventry.
Thanks for your opinion and help. Looks good, but the stamp is damaged- tear and a thin. Actually a nice strike and four margins.
Truth is the daughter of time

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

emason wrote:
22 Sep 2021 05:38
The poor strike and watery ink are typical of Coventry.
Spot on with the typical poor strike from Coventry

Coventry.jpeg

1d Red (plate 24) sent from Coventry to Ashby de la Zouch dated 29 Dec 1842.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by emason »

Badu wrote:
23 Sep 2021 08:35

Image

1d Red (plate 24) sent from Coventry to Ashby de la Zouch dated 29 Dec 1842.
Very nice indeed. It could almost persuade me to collect covers. :shock:
Best wishes,
Bill

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

emason wrote:
24 Sep 2021 04:53
It could almost persuade me to collect covers. :shock:
Thanks! The nice single strike of a Maltese Cross on cover is very much outnumbered in my collection though! Another recent purchase...

StAlbans.jpeg

1d Black (plate 6) sent from St Albans to London, dated 6 Oct 1840, cancelled by 4 strikes of an orange-red Maltese Cross.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

Peebles.jpeg

1d Black (plate 4) sent from Peebles to Rachan, dated 4 Feb 1841, cancelled by a red Maltese Cross. A strip of selvedge with marginal inscription used as a seal.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

Another scrappy one :D

NewcastleManyBlackMX.jpeg

1d Black sent from Newcastle-under-Lyme to London, dated 1 March 1841, cancelled by at least 4 black maltese crosses.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Global Administrator »

.
EVERY member reading this thread should take a look thru here for today's Cavendish sale.

https://stampauctionnetwork.com/CV/cv8401.cfm#3

Quality Early GB is hot. :)

Add near 25% to Hammer price to get to invoice prices, after Buyer Fees and VAT added.

This pretty 1d Black was invoiced about 1,750 quid for a normal plate! The 2d WAS near as high.


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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Global Administrator »

.
What do I know but this guy, at ONE THIRD the price at 575 quid seems the far better buy to me?

If I were pricing both for stock, assuming both basic plates and sound, no way would one be 3 times higher. :)

Glen


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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Rog »

Probably the centring of the MX that made that first one fly. But yes, both exceptional examples. 8-)

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by rossi »

Badu wrote:
21 Sep 2021 05:22
Image

Cheers for the thoughts both. Scan of the rear which should help. I think from this its pretty clear that it went London (28/9) -> Edinburgh (30/9) -> Glasgow (1/10).
The postmarks match what's written in the PO Directory of Edinburgh, June 1842.

The letter departed from London on 28 Sep at 8pm and arrived at Edinburgh on 30 Sep at 1.43am ( SEP / S 30 Morning / 1842 )
lon-edin-1842.png

Then the letter left Edinburgh at 9:30pm ( SEP / A 30 Evening / 1842 ) and arrived at Glasgow on 1 Oct at 2am
edin-glas-1842.png

and despatched with the first morning despatch at 7:30AM.
No-one ever said it was easy. If it was it would be boring!

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by rossi »

About the ``redirection`` I attach the complete time-table taken from the same PO directory of Edinburgh.

87037039.3.jpg

If the address was changed at the PO of Edinburgh, why the letter was not sent with the Edinburgh - Glasgow ( Day Railway ) at 10:42am ?
No-one ever said it was easy. If it was it would be boring!

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by rossi »

Some additional info.

The address of Lord Greenock was:
- 12 charlton terrace ( Edinburgh PO directory 1842 )
- Inverleith house ( Edinburgh PO directory 1843 )

Glasgow PO directory 1842/43, I didn't found him.

The address of Glasgow is Cathcart House, I've found a reference here:

cathcart.png
No-one ever said it was easy. If it was it would be boring!

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by Badu »

rossi wrote:
14 Oct 2021 21:41
Some additional info.
Thanks for all the additional info rossi - very helpful.

Picked the following up recently as another redirection example:

ColneRedirected.jpeg

2d Blue (plate 2) sent from Selby to Colne, dated 6 March 1842, cancelled by 2 strikes of a black Maltese Cross. Redirected back to Selby with 2 1d Reds (plate 16), arriving back on 8 March.

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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by rossi »

Badu wrote:
26 Sep 2021 01:39
Image
Even if Peebles and Rachan were very close

rachan.png

the letter had to pass through Edinburgh, the F in the postmark means Forenoon.

The piece of "paper" used to close the letter is an interesting one of course. :mrgreen:



ps
About William Lock esq. you can find some info about here and with google.
https://www.ancestry.com/genealogy/records/john-loch-24-3yfhnt
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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by CMJ »


A couple of nice coloured Maltese crosses; both "red" but in wildly differing shades.

C1595F.jpg
Haddington to Edinburgh, dated 4 December 1840
1d Black (plate 3), cancelled with a brown Maltese cross of Haddington [e]
Haddington datestamp in shade matching the cancellation


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Re: The Maltese Cross Cancel on GB Stamps Thread

Post by CMJ »


C1594F.jpg
Ormskirk to Preston, dated 4 October 1840
1d Black (plate 1b) cancelled with a pink Maltese cross of Ormskirk [e]
Ormskirk datestamp in shade matching the cancellation


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