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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 27 Jun 2010 03:50
by lithograving
Super great posting joelk, I really enjoyed getting this information as I am very interested in the engravers of different countries.

It also shows that everything involves politics. Here is Gandon trying to make a living in his trade, engraving stamps for an unpopular regime (what else could/should he have done ?) and he gets stigmatized after liberation.
Was he also the designer of the 1943 bombing stamp ?

I look forward to more of your postings.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 27 Jun 2010 03:56
by joelk
Thank you very much Lithograving! In fact he was the designer of that stamp as well.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 27 Jun 2010 04:00
by lithograving
joelk wrote:Thank you very much Lithograving! In fact he was the designer of that stamp as well.


Thanks. I have a question. Was he pro Vichy or apolitical as far as one could be during those times ?

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 27 Jun 2010 06:30
by joelk
It's a good question. He was certainly not in the Resistance, but I have seen no evidence he was strongly pro Vichy other than the stamps he had engraved. At the very least, and not to his credit, he went 'with the flow'.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 27 Jun 2010 10:55
by lithograving
At the very least, and not to his credit, he went 'with the flow'.

I would say that the majority of people in similar circumstances would go with the flow.

How many of us would be heroes ?

Apparently after the war it seems like everybody claimed they were in the Resistance when it was nice & safe.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 27 Jun 2010 13:20
by lithograving
The Republic of China (Taiwan ) produced some fine examples of engraved stamps.
Also notice the granite paper used to print some of the stamps.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 28 Jun 2010 16:52
by KevinHedley
Sweden 1989 SG 1436

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 28 Jun 2010 17:59
by asmodeus
One of my favourites: Stamps was shown already but here is it gain:
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and the 1£ PUC
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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 02 Jul 2010 14:12
by lithograving
The following are Swedish stamps from various engravers showing different styles but I would say none compare with the works of Czeslaw Slania even though they are all fine examples of the art of engraving.

The stamp below by master engraver Sven Ewert was originally issued perforations all sides in 1941 and reissued booklet perf 3 sides in 1958
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The following were engraved by Arne Wallhorn who was chief engraver after Sven Ewert retired.

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Here are some by Majvor Franzen one of the few female engravers that I am aware of.

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And some by Heinz Gutschmidt

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And finally a couple engraved by Zlato Jakus.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 02 Jul 2010 14:58
by lithograving
And here are some by the Master himself...

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 03 Jul 2010 11:05
by BACK O BOURKE
$5.00 1894 Dark Green Unwatermarked Bureau Issue

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Scott 263

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 03 Jul 2010 13:00
by lithograving
Austria has issued many fine engraved stamps over the years but none surpassed the ones produced during the late forties and up to the early sixties.

There were so many superb engravers such as Lorber, Woyty, Ranzoni, Toth, Wimmer plus a few others.
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This stamp (actually the whole series) is one of my favourites.The engraving and rich colour makes this a beautiful stamp.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 04 Jul 2010 03:22
by figmente
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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 04 Jul 2010 06:05
by revenuecollector
I'll chime in with a few older pieces. ;)

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Closeup:

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Closeup:

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 04 Jul 2010 06:37
by jugoslavija_post
Why did they engrave the revenues so nicely if they were never really seen by the public?? :roll:

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 04 Jul 2010 10:40
by lithograving
[quote="revenuecollector"]I'll chime in with a few older pieces. ;)

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I really like that Black Jack, it's one of my favourite stamps even though I don't own one.

Is this the grey black issue since I remember seeing one much darker called intense black I believe.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 26 Jul 2010 21:24
by KevinHedley
I often have problems working out what is engraved and what is not. Perhaps a master class is required :!:

If this recent stamp is engraved please tell me and I will post the rest of the set.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 26 Jul 2010 23:04
by Catweazle
Some illustrators illustrate with lots of lines and dashes, like this one by Edward Ardizonne (spelling?):

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But then there would also be prints of engraved images.

Then again, maybe that stamps was engraved...

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 29 Jul 2010 01:56
by lithograving
KevinHedley wrote:I often have problems working out what is engraved and what is not. Perhaps a master class is required :!:

If this recent stamp is engraved please tell me and I will post the rest of the set.

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The main part of the stamp (dark blue) is engraved but the yellow and the light blue globe on the lower right are photogravure. Many Belgian stamps are printed using this combination method whereby engraving is used for the fine details and photogravure for the background & to add colour.

There was a thread awhile back which touched on different printing types.

https://www.stampboards.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=16064&p=591010#p591010

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 29 Jul 2010 05:22
by joelk
Lithograving, that is correct. I am not aware that Belgium ever used a multicolor engraving technique, hence the many stamps that are combinations of line engraving and photogravure. The French are the masters of multicolor line engraved stamps, with their special printing machines, the TD-3 (3 colors), used from 1939, and the TD-6 (6 colors!), brought into service in 1960, with the bird series of December 1960.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 29 Jul 2010 05:33
by joelk
And there they are...A little smudgy in places, but what an amazing technical feat. To be precise, despite the 6 color capability, this set only used 5. Still...



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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 30 Jul 2010 15:13
by lithograving
Yes joelk the French have consistently printed fine mulicolour steel engraved stamps probably the only country to do so.

The Swedish Stamp Printing Works has also produced some, but most countries print only steel combined with photogravure or offset/lithography.

Below a couple from Sweden printed in mulicolour steel.

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Compared to the Stockholmia 86 booklet printed by combination steel and offset/lithography

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This stamp shows the legendary court engraver Swen Ewert who engraved almost all Swedish stamps from 1928 to the end of the 1950s. I believe he also designed some himself.
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This stamp was part of a joint issue with the USA, notice it was created by the excellent American engraver Hipschen.
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Sweden has in the past contracted out to outside printers such as this miniature sheet which was printed by Johann Enschede en Zonen, Holland combining Steel Engraving and Photogravure

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The Swedish Post Office turned to the Bank of Finland Security Printing House to produce this last example,also using the combined steel and photogravure method.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 31 Jul 2010 08:14
by lithograving
I would like to show a few examples of various combination printings of Canadian stamps.

In 1968 Canada Post decided to add some colour to their stamps and therefore asked their then current printer Canadian Bank Note Company, Ottawa to provide more colour capabilities with their presses . They also added British American Bank Note Company, Ottawa and in 1971 Ashton Potter Ltd, Toronto.
CBNC and BABNC also printed Canadian paper money and had ofcourse experience in engraving but in the beginning were just experimenting with combination presses. Ashton Potter used only offset/lithography.

BABNC combined steel engraving with photogravure as shown by the 2 examples below.
I will show first the plate block with the printers inscription and then a close up of the single for more detail.

Scott # 482 1968
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Scott # 494 1969
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CBNC decided to go with steel engraving combined with offset/ lithography. See one early example below from 1969

Scott # 501
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one from 1998 where you can see they added in the selvage the printing colours used and the letter P which stands for Peterborough the paper manufacturer.

Scott # 1738
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and more recent, the $2 SS from 2005
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BABNC (engraving) and CBNC (lithography) produced a joint effort with the next one.

Scott # 655
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British American Bank Note and Ashton Potter combined to print the 1972 $1 and $2 definitives.

Scott# 601
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Finally an example where the same definitives were reprinted by a different contractor.

CBNC first printed the low values of the 1977 definitives using steel engraving/lithography. See the 4c below.

Scott # 709
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Then in 1979 British American Bank Note reprinted them, combining steel engraving with photogravure. Notice the mottled background which is characteristic of photogravure.

Scott# 784
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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 01 Aug 2010 02:52
by joelk
Lithograving, thank you very much for your posts on Swedish stamps, multi-color steel engraving and the Swedish master engravers. This was great learning for me, and I look at Swedish stamps differently now. Here is a little treat for the weekend, a proof engraving by Pierre Gandon, done in 1945, quite lovely in my opinion:


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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 01 Aug 2010 03:04
by GlenStephens
What a great French proof!

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 01 Aug 2010 03:17
by joelk
8) Thank you Glen! I've always felt there was something very special about it, its composition and the face, and Gandon's signature doesn't hurt of course. One of my absolute favorites.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 01 Aug 2010 06:15
by lithograving
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That's a real work of art Joel. What is the value of something like that ?

Do you know how many copies were made?

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 01 Aug 2010 07:22
by lithograving
I'm curious to know what preferences members here have comparing offset with photogravure combined with engraving, if any?

Personally I like offset especially when the stamp has large areas of dark solid colours because it doesn't show the mottled effect of photogravure. Also the new offset printing presses seem to use a finer screen which gives the appearance of photogravure.
I believe its called photo/lithography .

On the other hand, the photo colours are much more lively whereas on some stamps the offset colours look drab.

Another angle when comparing the two printing methods is which countries, actually which printing companies (since many private & state printers produce stamps for other countries) use one or the other or both.
Part of it is production cost. Offset is cheaper than photogravure and both of course cost a lot less than engraving.

Here is a short, incomplete list of the few countries still producing engraved stamps and even some of these issue them only sporadically in the last decade.

Steel engraving combined with photogravure

Austria, Czech Republic, Belgium, Italy and I'm not sure but maybe Russia

Steel engraving combined with offset/lithography

Canada,Denmark,Netherlands (actually Johan Enschede & Sons) Sweden ofcourse and USA which uses various private concerns since the BEP no longer prints stamps.

I'm not too acquainted with French stamps but they probably still produce multicolour engraved but I believe the State Printing works did print combination issues using both offset and photogravure in the past. I'm sure Joel would know.

Finally, I wonder how many of these will still print any kind of engraved stamps within say the next 10 years. Who knows if stamps will even still be needed in 2010.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 02 Aug 2010 01:19
by joelk
Lithograving, with such an implicit endorsement of expertise, I could only do one thing to answer your questions: research (since I wasn't really sure of the answers :? ).

Anyways, the French have produced some stamps with mixed methods (steel engraving and offset combined), but very rarely so. They are still very attached to the tradition of pure line engraving, and since Sarkozy, I believe there is even a mandate as to the proportion of stamps that need to be produced in intaglio.

As for the artist's proof by Gandon, it is indeed quite rare. Such proofs were not very well controlled before 1959, but the belief is that there would have been a maximum of a little over 20 or so. I paid 95 euros including buyer's premium at an auction in Belgium in 2006. I think it's a terrific bargain.

There are similar proof by Belgian engravers, particularly Janssens and De Bast. I believe their level of rarity is similar. The prices are typically between 100 and 300 euros a proof, although I have paid as much as 600. Of course, if you want all the proofs of a complete set of stamps (I'm thinking the Belgium UPU set of 1952, 12 stamps) it could burn a hole in your pocket well in excess of a 1000 euros. Still, I think they are great, and given their rarity, very good value.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 02 Aug 2010 03:41
by lithograving
Thanks for the info joel.

I'm surprised that the President of France concerns himself with stamp production. Then again he is a strange guy.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 02 Aug 2010 06:05
by joelk
Lithograving, actually he's a stamp collector himself...

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 10 Aug 2010 19:57
by KevinHedley
I have already posted this one issued by Belgium in 2009 and now follow it with the remaining 4 stamps.

The set is of "World Heritage of Belgium" and this stamp features the Historic Centre of Bruges

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 10 Aug 2010 20:00
by KevinHedley
Belgium 2009.

The set is of "World Heritage of Belgium" and this stamp features the Neolithic Flint Mines at Spiennes (Mons)

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 10 Aug 2010 20:02
by KevinHedley
Belgium 2009.

The set is of "World Heritage of Belgium" and this stamp features the Notre Dame Cathedral in Tournai

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 10 Aug 2010 20:05
by KevinHedley
Belgium 2009.

The set is of "World Heritage of Belgium" and this stamp features the Plantin Moretus House - Workshops - Museum complex (Anvers)

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 10 Aug 2010 20:07
by KevinHedley
Belgium 2009.

The set is of "World Heritage of Belgium" and this stamp features the Major town houses of the Architect Victor Horta in Brussels

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 06:21
by lithograving
Good stuff Kevin might as well join you and see if we can get this to go to page six.

The following are from German occupied Poland the so-called Generalgouvernement ( I could never understand why they picked this name)

Set from 1944 was engraved and printed by the Staatsdruckerei Vienna.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 06:26
by lithograving
Andreas Schlüter 1664 - 1714, German baroque sculptor and architect .

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 06:28
by lithograving
Hans Boner or Bauer 1463 - 1523, Merchant

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 06:30
by lithograving
Augustus the Strong 1670 - 1733, Elector of Saxony and King of Poland.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 06:34
by lithograving
Georg Gottlieb Pusch or in Polish called Jerzy Bogumił Pusz, 1791 - 1846, Geologist

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 06:54
by LordVader92
This one is one of my favorites.

It's an 1898 Portuguese commemorative stamp.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 07:03
by lithograving
Austria, similarly to Germany was divided into 4 occupation zones after WWII. These are the engraved high values of the first (and only) definitive series issued in the Soviet Zone. The lower values were either letterpress or lithography and all were printed by the State Printing Works in Vienna.


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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 07:06
by lithograving
Close up of the 5 Reichsmark.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 07:13
by lithograving
LordVader92 wrote:This one is one of my favorites.

It's an 1898 Portuguese commemorative stamp.

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Yes it's a finely engraved stamp as are many other Portuguese. The set was actually printed by Waterlow & Sons Ltd in England.

Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 12 Aug 2010 08:25
by lithograving
Here are a few more Austrian engraved stamps.

Michel# 1082. Commemorating the 40th anniversary of the plebiscite which kept the Land (province) of Carinthia (Kärnten) in Austria instead of being part of Yugoslavia.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 12 Aug 2010 08:31
by lithograving
Michel # 1098 Commemorating in 1961 the 40th anniversary of the Land (province) of Burgenland being part of Austria. Burgenland means Land of castles in German.

This was one of the first Austrian multicolour stamps printed by combining recess engraving and offset/lithography

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 12 Aug 2010 08:49
by lithograving
Austria Michel# 1110 Commemorating 100th anniversary of the death of Austrian painter Friedrich Gauermann. Stamp is based on a self portrait. Engraved by Adelbert Pilch.
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The engraving is exquisite IMO. Look at the detail in the close up.

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This 1964 stamp below was based on one of his paintings.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 12 Aug 2010 12:16
by lithograving
Michel # 1130 Hermann Bahr ,Austrian writer, playwright, director, and critic. Combination printing, recess and offset.

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Re: Engraved Beauties

Posted: 12 Aug 2010 12:29
by lithograving
Michel # 1199 Bertha von Suttner,was an Austrian novelist, radical (organizational) pacifist, and the first woman to be a Nobel Peace Prize laureate.
The stamp was issued on the 60th anniversary of her receiving the Nobel Prize.
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