Which catalogue is best for valuing my world stamps?

[alice_usa]

.
Which publication is best for valuing and cataloging my world stamps?

Hello.

I want to be able to catalog my stamps with their appropriate numbers and current values.

Do the Scott catalogs cover world stamps? Are catalogs updated each year with new stamps and new values?

I'd like to learn more about what catalog references would be best to organize my collection.

Any comments and suggestions would be appreciated about how the cataloging system works. Most of my collection are mid 1800's to mid to late 1900's.

Thank you.
.

[librarianc]

Alice:

Welcome to Stampboards!

The short answer is that most North American collectors use SCOTT as their reference.

Most dealers and collectors in NA are familiar with Scott numbering and the way they organize the stamps of most countries.

The rest of the world use a range of worldwide publications (Stanley Gibbons, Michel, Yvert) all of which have their own rules for inclusion of stamps, numbering and pricing.

To begin, pick one (likely Scott) and learn about the hobby. Once you have a working knowledge and have asked a thousand questions of friends, local club members and online, then you can decide if you want to include other references in your personal library.

I hope that helps.

John A

[ddaann]

Alice, The Scott catalog is very spendy, but you may be able to find it at your local library or through interlibrary loan.

Some cities in Ontario also have a stamp collector's club where you can get a lot of help.

[kuikka]

Not all stamp values are reviewed every time a new catalogue is published. Also, for various reasons some countries don't include latest stamp issues in a new catalogue. What might be advisable is that after looking into catalogues in your library, you may first want to order an older set of catalogues (which you could get on a fraction of the price of the new set), say 3-5 years old. As the new stamps are nowadays much harder to come by, you may find you do not even need the listing of the latest stamps.

Regarding of your options of the world wide catalogues, you have 4 options listed earlier (Scott, Stanley Gibbons (SG), Michel and Yvert & Tellier (YT)). None of them are specialized with their global listing, so, if you need that level, you need to look for local options (and that list is both long and incomplete). Which one of the 4 world wide catalogues suit for you depends on your needs. First is language.

If it needs to be in English, you have only 2 options left: Scott and SG. Both are published annually but SG only as simplified version. However, being simplified it may be cheaper. YT is in French and has likely the best back-of-the-book (BOB) section.

Michel is in German and has probably the most detailed listing. Also, it attempts to show all the stamps (with the exception of wall paper issues). Both YT (as far as I know) and Michel (for sure) don't publish whole world annually.

So, the question is, what do you really need and what are you willing to pay for it.
.

[Brit-Col]

Hello Alice,

I notice you are in Houston.

Allow me to introduce you to the Texas Stamp Dealers Association, which has four shows each year in Houston. See their website at: https://www.tsdastamps.com/

You may be able to pick up an older set of Scott catalogues from one of the dealers in attendance.

You should also be able to pick up information on local clubs and other stamp-related resources.

As said above, in the United States the Scott catalogue is the accepted standard. Unless your collection is highly specialized Scott is what you should go with.

Good luck!

BC

[polisciguy2011]

Michel is starting to publish a (small) handful of titles in English, to add to the list above. So if your area of interest is Germany (or Luxembourg, which seems to be the first non-German English catalog), that could also be of use to you, though as others have noted the standard here in the US is going to be Scott.

[Global Admin]

.
As you are USA based, agree Scott makes more sense, but warning a full set is TWELVE large volumes these days, in a massive carton and costs many $100s new,( $1500 here due to shipping costs and taxes!) so do check locally for a used set perhaps as Brit-Col outlines above.

Gibbons is widely used outside the USA but again a 16 kilo or 40 pound carton, and even 2 years out of date they cost $100s - I have this discount offer here -

Glen

Stanley Gibbons 2018 "Stamps Of The World" Stamp Catalogues 6 volumes $300 under Retail: The set is $A700 retail locally. SAVE over $300! To buy direct off SG UK costs you $7750. Buy off me, and pay $350 less than buying discounted direct off SG in UK! Stanley Gibbons Stamps of the World Vol 1-6, 2018 - THE most useful set in your library! Scott recently split their World set from 6 to TWELVE expensive volumes, costing locally here, WAY over $A1,500. If SG do the same next year, you will save a FORTUNE buying these NOW! A STACK more photos and detail and info here - https://tinyurl.com/SOTW18 BRAND NEW in SG factory storage Carton - mention it at your stamp club - they might need one - just $A399 (Stock 892JQ)

[Sargonnas]

If your primary intent is to catalogue your stamps it might be an idea to subscribe to stampworld.com.

It is an online catalogue and free to use. I know it doesn't match the traditional catalogues and I do not know whether the values they show for the stamps are correct but it is quite comprehensive and at least for most european countries their listing is correct.

[Phila-Tourist]

.
I suggest you make your decision practical rather than dogmatic. If you want to compile an inventory of your stamps for the sole purpose of selling them in a particular region of the world, use whatever catalogue is the most popular in that region.


If not:

1) What catalogue is best (most detailed/accurate) for your stamps? Your local philatelic societies should be able to advise you.

2) What languages can you read? It makes little sense to use Yvert & Tellier if you don't speak French...

3) Above all: how much do you want to spend on buying catalogues? There are expensive! The most realistic option may be to learn to work with whatever catalogue is available for free in your local library.


If you intend to embark on a short-term project of stamp listing (one year?), consider getting a subscription to the online version of the Michel catalogue. An English interface is now available. You get instant access to a catalogue range that would cost thousands of euros to buy. The on-screen version is not as user-friendly or as detailed as a bound book catalogue, but it is much more accessible. When you are done, just cancel your subscription.

[AdmiralCollector]

Alice, The Scott catalog is very spendy, but you may be able to find it at your local library or through interlibrary loan.

Try your local library. At present I have 2 volumes of Scott checked out from my local library. I can have them for 3 weeks, and if no one else puts a hold on them, they will renew for 3 more weeks -- up to 4 renewals of 3 weeks each. I can put holds on them from my computer, and in 2-3 days they are usually at my branch for pickup.

As you get more into stamps, you may find that prices do not go up very much, and/or you may not need to catalog new issues from most countries. At that point you may find you'll be satisfied with a set that is several years old, and many dollars cheaper.

[alice_usa]

Thank you everyone for all of your valuable input.

I appreciate the time you all took to inform me.

[Catweazle]

Another thought - which countries do you collect?

Are you a world wide collector of stamps, or do you prefer to focus on individual countries? Then yes, you'll likely find Scott easy enough to source in the states, or even from your local library, as others have said. Stanley Gibbons are also useful.

Remember too that your local library can probably order in books they don't have from other regional libraries with whom they have connections or share similar facilities.

If, however, you prefer to focus on more specific regions when it comes to collecting stamps, you might consider other, more specific catalogues too. For example, I might use Facit if dabbling in Scandinavian stamps, or Stanley Gibbons for the British Commonwealth, or Scott for the USA. The ACSC is useful for Australia, I find, or Michel for Germany and German colonies.

They all have their uses, pros and cons!

Incidentally, hardcopy catalogues such as those we've already mentioned are the best. For general reference only, StampWorld or Colnect are also useful online tools.

[Andyref2]

This is a good thread for ideas on valuing a collection. I have been working this taske for a couple of years mainly to make sure I have sufficient insurance incase of a complete disaster (aka in Southern California high desert the fear of a) wildfires and b) earthquakes). I purchased the 2019 Scott catalogs to make sure I properly identified the stamps (feeling 90% confident I achieved that goal) and submitted invoice scans of prices paid along with scans of Scott catalog pricing to the insurance company.

I discovered for the most part the Scott catalog is 100% spot on for identification, but as with anything pricing is way off since the stamp market is 100% supply and demand. I determined based on invoice pricing to insure my collection for about 40% of my catalog value which leaves me a bit short of what I actually paid, but it won't be a complete loss.

If we need to evacuate in a hurry, there is simply no way to load my four Harris Standard albums, U.S. Heritage collection albums, the eight Lighthouse leather books and 28 D-ring note books with Vario stock pages! Uh uh, no way! But all those stamps are recorded in an Access Database with price paid and 2019 catalog values.

I'd hate to lose the collection though, it is really incredible what I have accomplished since I started collecting as a 9 year old in 1971 to now, 50 years later!

Enjoy your task at hand and most important: Have fun!

[passport_collect]

Visit your local public library and ask if they have any stamp catalogues you can look at. Sometimes they keep their latest edition as "reference only" and an older set or two that can be borrowed. That is my experience in the UK and the US.

[Andyref2]

Thank you for the reply! This little town finally opened a library and I have donated $ to help the cause, but they do not seem interested in one donating books etc. I was quite surprised. Even my 2019 Scott catalogs might be of interest to someone! They truly are a great source of reference!

[leithy]

Do most catalogues give proper valuations of stamps. I know Gibbons is the retail value of their items if in stock but does not mean your stamps are worth that amount. To get an idea of market prices I try to find dealers and see their prices, usually a huge discount on Gibbons. I cannot comment on the other catalogues as I have not used them.

[GB 789]

Do most catalogues give proper valuations of stamps. I know Gibbons is the retail value of their items if in stock but does not mean your stamps are worth that amount. To get an idea of market prices I try to find dealers and see their prices, usually a huge discount on Gibbons. I cannot comment on the other catalogues as I have not used them.

I think you are referring to a catalogue showing market values rather than a dealer’s retail price list like SG.

There are examples in the market such as British Stamp Market Values which is an alternative to SG’s Collect British Stamps. Whilst the values in the catalogue are closer to reality they are still not perfect.

I honestly don’t think there can be a universal market value catalogue because there are too many discrepancies involved. The market for a certain stamp area will be completely different in different countries so a catalogue may reflect market prices in one country but this may not be accurate for the market in another country.

As highlighted many times by members on here, the value of catalogues is in their research and relative indication of scarcity rather than them reflecting actual market prices. As I said earlier, I think such a catalogue would be near on impossible to create and keep up to date unless you had a multi million pound budget and many staff to keep an eye on values across all markets!

[leithy]

I tend to use catalogues to identify stamp issues. I have not seen British Stamp Market values. The problem with valuing stamps is there can be a high % difference between what a dealer will pay, or what can be achieved at auction, compared to the retail price. A collector selling will not receive retail price.

[polisciguy2011]

Am I wrong in thinking that catalogue value today is, essentially, the insurance value rather than any kind of fair-market value for most issues? That seems to be the case with at least some dealers' advice I have gotten over the years when it came to taking out insurance, since our homeowner policy only provides nominal coverage for collectibles and art.

[Andyref2]

I have the same issue Zach. To add "collectable" coverage to my homeowner policy will cost an arm and a leg - i.e. buy my collection all over again every fourth year. Geeesh. I am told American Philatelic Society offers stamp insurance and more services. I may consider this.

My current homeowner insurance provider had me provide copies of receipts, copies of catalogs (some pages and all the covers of the books), some photos of my collection and that still didn't seem to satisfy the insurance company.

My thought was: Catalog value around $100k, receipts for $60k, insurance around $30k and I'd be out $30k, but that alone would again be cost prohibitive! I record my collection in an Access Data Base, maintain scanned copies of receipts and some photos. Maybe at some point I will find insurance coverage.

Good luck!

[polisciguy2011]

I have the same issue Zach. To add "collectable" coverage to my homeowner policy will cost an arm and a leg - i.e. buy my collection all over again every fourth year. Geeesh. I am told American Philatelic Society offers stamp insurance and more services. I may consider this.

My current homeowner insurance provider had me provide copies of receipts, copies of catalogs (some pages and all the covers of the books), some photos of my collection and that still didn't seem to satisfy the insurance company.

My thought was: Catalog value around $100k, receipts for $60k, insurance around $30k and I'd be out $30k, but that alone would again be cost prohibitive! I record my collection in an Access Data Base, maintain scanned copies of receipts and some photos. Maybe at some point I will find insurance coverage.

Good luck!

Yes, they offer plans through Hugh Wood, I believe is the name. I'm working on getting everything properly cataloged so I can pursue insurance through them eventually; I had a policy ages ago, but it lapsed while I was in college and had sold any expensive items I owned as a kid to help cover costs.

I believe that they accept catalog value as the basis of the "value" of the collection, much like with art or antiques. Don't forget to include the costs of albums and materials, too! I believe in the past Glen has noted that many insurers will cover those if properly accounted for.

[Number-O-Ne]

I am told American Philatelic Society offers stamp insurance and more services. I may consider this.

My current homeowner insurance provider had me provide copies of receipts, copies of catalogs (some pages and all the covers of the books), some photos of my collection and that still didn't seem to satisfy the insurance company.

My thought was: Catalog value around $100k, receipts for $60k, insurance around $30k and I'd be out $30k, but that alone would again be cost prohibitive! I record my collection in an Access Data Base, maintain scanned copies of receipts and some photos. Maybe at some point I will find insurance coverage.

Good luck!

APS insurance is reasonable and much more affordable. Their only condition is to keep APS membership. I have that for more than a decade.

I think your yearly premium would be a lot less than buying your collection once every 4-5 years.

[Global Admin]

ALL insurers globally will gleefully accept your premiums. No brainer. For decades.

When it comes time for a claim to be made, the fun begins.

An Excel spread sheet, cheerfuly compiled by the OWNER, of what allegedly once existed, will get ZERO belief from most hard-nosed insurers - they'd all be broke overnight if they accepted that form of 'proof'!

'Hey my 5 Solid Gold Rolexes, and my 5 carat Diamond, First Edition James Bond novels, and 100 Gold Sovereigns were all stolen last night - here is my cool looking Excel sheet I just printed out as proof they really existed. Please mail me a $200,000 cheque'. Good luck with that!


I wrote a detailed piece on these here -

https://www.glenstephens.com/snseptember20.html

Are your stamps INSURED?

I am always amazed at how many otherwise very savvy collectors mention in conversation they have ZERO formal insurance documents covering their stamps. Often for 6 figure collections. The USA seems rather lenient on stamp insurance paperwork. In Australia and elsewhere Insurance companies are (understandably) very hard-nosed and tough.

I do several Insurance valuations and claims matters every month, and have flown to all states to do this. Not just for insurance, but for divorce, and inheritance and probate matters etc, as outlined here in detail - www.tinyurl.com/GlenIns These days there is no retail stamp shop in the entire city of Sydney, so those in country areas etc, have NO hope of a local dealer doing it!

You MUST get stamps insured.

In Australia, in short - if your stamps are stolen, burnt, water damaged etc, you generally have **ZERO** chance of getting a cent refunded, unless you can furnish insurer with a detailed, dated, and all signed off assessment, all done well BEFORE the alleged event occurs.

Insurers here ask that it be done by a qualified, independent stamp valuer, and a member of the relevant Stamp Dealer Trade Associations, whom they recognise. A scribbled note from your mate at a stamp club etc, they will simply NOT accept, as many assume AFTER the event will be the case!

Penny Pinching brings $100,000 loss!

One local client had about $100,000 real world value of mainly Kangaroo stamps etc, purchased over the decades, from dealers, fairs, and on-line etc. He asked me what it would cost for a formal typed valuation, and told him the typical cost was a few $100 to cover my time.

Mr. Genius snorted derisively, and stated that was far too high. He said he had an Excel document listing them all in great detail, along with the recent catalogue values etc, and he felt happy his detailed inventory was totally adequate to satisfy any possible Insurance claim, should one occur.

He was burgled a few months later, and cheerfully emailed his inventory to his Insurers after the theft to be paid out in full, and they basically laughed, and said he might well have typed that up a few hours back, and paid him zero, and declined the claim entirely.

“Father Knows Best”!

My Dad used to call that kind of cheapskate logic "Penny Wise, Pound Foolish" and this fellow's "saving" of a couple $100, for a professional written valuation, cost him his $100,000 collection more or less. The stamps are gone forever. He never saw them again, and he wore the entire loss. Genius.

Anything less than that kind of detailed valuation, all dated and lodged with insurer in advance, being a copy of the original documentation, and you have no chance in general of being paid out here. In general insurers trust NOBODY!

Often there is a modest nominal sum covered for ”general household goods” stolen or damaged on any Home Contents Policy, but nothing like covering the full amount of larger stamp collections. It might be capped at $1,000 or $2,500 etc. (Here in Australia anyway, I can't speak for overseas countries.)

Useful for Police & Dealer tracking.

The good thing about a detailed written valuation, is that it can be handed to Police to assist them, and also circulated globally to stamp dealer bodies. I get regular advices from PTS/ASDA/IFSDA listing stolen material, and stamp dealers are a very small group, that communicate very well, and we very often help recover the goods.

You need to specify cost of ALBUMS.

I generally take photos of the better items in collections, and again these are essentially a “Fingerprint” that protects your material. Own a 5/- Bridge with a Kalgoorlie cancel and that is likely unique. A Druggie caught trying to sell that is behind bars if the Cops have my image on file.

Likewise, I also have another ID trick I pass on to those whose goods I have valued, that almost no-one has ever thought of. Like the photos, it is a certain set of handcuffs to anyone caught with YOUR books when claiming “Grandma left them to him last week” etc.

A common mistake is not to specify the replacement costs of your albums and pages and catalogues etc. The 4 x “Lighthouse” albums shown nearby I sold to a client with Australia hingeless pages in them. Cost him $A1,800 alone. In his case, my written valuation had $42,500 for stamps, and $5,000 to replace the Hagners, albums, slipcases, catalogues and reference books. Many dealers lazily fail to list those, or to value them.

For all written valuations, I email a very detailed copy to the client after close inspection. I urge the collectors to print out 2 copies. ONE to keep filed away safely, (well away from stamps!) the other copy I suggest they mail Registered Post to their insurer to attach to their client files.

THEN if your formal valuation dated June, 2020 is on their file, and your house is burgled, flooded or burnt down etc in September 2020, and the Police/Fire Department reports confirms that event, they tend to accept that stamp loss as real and legitimate, and they pay up on it pretty fast.

Many large Insurers in Australia have a “new for old” policy when covering household contents. This is terrific news for stamp collectors. ALL stockbooks and Hagner sheets MUST be replaced every 20 years or so, as they start to age, and that can damage the stamps. So if you have a claim, all your 20 year old books and sheets are replaced with NEW ones!

$50,000 refund based on my paperwork.

One client got ~$50,000 back recently, based solely on my very detailed valuation letter of about a year earlier, which outlined the replacement value of his stamps, hingeless pages, and reference books, and catalogues, and the extensive set of quality albums he had them all stored in.

etc, etc,



This REAL WORLD advice will go in one ear and out the other to many armchair experts here. No problems. But it IS based on 45 years of REAL experience and 100 horror stories I can relate. Your cool 'THEORIES' mean zippo to a hard-nosed insurer when the crunch comes.

Glen

[Andyref2]

Great information! I have kept all my receipts, cancelled checks, but hopefully (knock on wood) I won't have to experience a theft of my collection! I hope the same for everyone else out there as well!

Thank you!