Thoughts about the STAMPS of UK King Charles III?

[Global Admin]

Was Camilla the designer?

Totally Priceless image.

[Rob K]

Even bigger

So the main identifying feature is... the eyebrows?

[Global Admin]

Even bigger

So the main identifying feature is... the eyebrows?

More the ill-fitting shirt 4 neck sizes too large. The work experience intern person at Royal Mail got the design job.

Or maybe the Church Of England made him wear sackcloth (bulky stuff I hear?) for ignoring those really annoying and pesky basic Commandments, like 'Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery' and 'Thou Shall Not Covet Thy Neighbour's Wife' ?

However, the vignette does at least hide the sagging jowels, and the huge ears.

[Rockyman44]

Link to the BBC news article on this issue:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64940530

Great Britain 2023 garden flowers stamps

[norvic]

And the actual stamps, which arrived this morning.

Great Britain set of 10 x 1st class Flowers stamps issued 23 March 2023.

[ViccyVFU]

It still seems a bit "R's about face" to issue a stamp with a silhouette of the king before a definitive stamp "depicting his image".

But then, as they've chosen not to issue an NVI for a basic parcel (Their first love, and current focus, allegedly), I guess its letting people know that "All the kings issues will be a pure money grab, before they are phased out completely" .

Has anyone here decided QEII is "the line" for collecting modern GB?
.....And do you still intend to stick to it?

I've not seen anything in the Kings portfolio, to date, that would make me think "I wish there was one person out there that still used stamps, and sent me one!!.

[Finchley Chris]

I stopped at 2000 - too much expensive tat after then.

I have, however, ordered a set of the KC3 definitives and the new flower issues...

[Global Admin]

Has anyone here decided QEII is "the line" for collecting modern GB?

..... And do you still intend to stick to it?

I've not seen anything in the Kings portfolio, to date, that would make me think "I wish there was one person out there that still used stamps, and sent me one!!.

I have a strong feeling more folks will totally cease collecting GB new issues in 2023, more than any other reign change.

For 3 reasons.

1. Charles is hardly popular, never has been, and these stamps are the dreariest anyone could possibly have designed of him - even Diana. Even many Brits here agree.

2. 'End Of An Era'. Lots of folks reluctantly bought the past 10 or 15 years mentally saying - 'I'll draw a line in the sand when she passes and spend that money saved on earlier gaps'. AND they will. This a VAST group of folks.

3. The complete morons at Royal Mail who decided to ad-hoc demonitise every Machin for 60 years, decimating the value of not only all Machin collections globally, but ALL QE2 issues as collateral damage. The QE2 stamp market has COLLAPSED - entirely due to this dumb decision. 'Crisis Of Confidence' Run on the banks type herd mentality. 'Commems Might Be Next' - which of course they might be, with these same cretins in charge. So no-one will buy them, especially with Charlie vignette wearing a shirt collar 3 sizes too large.

A very nasty and unprecedented Trifecta Confluence, that will see new issues sales HALVE (or more) this year over last year, costing the PO mega, mega millions, in MEGA high profit lost New Issue sales. Insane.

These embarrassing jokes will be as popular with the public as the Richard Nixon stamps were in the USA. The public there HATED them. Hopefully savvy collectors will use QE2 COMMEMS for all sendings, and not spend good English pounds, and use this artistic insult. Quite legal and quite pretty.

[norvic]

These are getting widespread coverage with a lot of people suggesting that they will buy them - because they are 'nice stamps'.

And the actual stamps, which arrived this morning.

But your three reasons are in the wrong order for your Trifecta.

The reason that most people cite is number 2.

The reason that more people than otherwise might have cited number , is number 3.

Charles is popularity is irrelevant to many collectors of GB. They buy the stamps because they like the stamps. They may not buy the definitives - although the ones with white backgrounds will be better as they were with the Machin. But they won't give up because they don't like the King.

[ViccyVFU]

These are getting widespread coverage with a lot of people suggesting that they will buy them - because they are 'nice stamps'.

A lot of people say silly things in surveys (especially when "trying not to look silly" on social media ).

I can't see people seeking these out, over say the convenience of a booklet of 4 "Charly-noggin" stamps (that won't expire / look dated "faster than a banana").

I'd say the main reason people are not going to be buying hoards of the 10 flowers stamps are that RM have conceded "they don't deliver the (1st class) service people have paid for". Its a shambles ... they are in disarray.

Buy them to use them, short term, fine.
But there is no appreciation on 4th April - It still only conveys "the same letters over the same distance".

Which kid nowadays wants to spend £25 / month on "bits of paper they can't / won't use", that maybe fetch 25% on resale??

Maybe their education taught them some lessons about money that "old people" are still having difficulty in coming to grips with?

[Rog]

Don't forget that some people buy stamps because they like them and not as an investment

[ViccyVFU]

Don't forget that some people buy stamps because they like them and not as an investment

Yes, but the only way you'd meet a person like that "outside of an old peoples home"
is if you rang the fire bell!!

[Rog]

Haha good one

[Ubobo.R.O.]

Yep. The Charley stamps are even more boring than the Betty ones !
That is quite an achievement.
Congratulations Royal Mail.

[Rigs]

It's the comb-over which is the worst? Get a haircut and try to look part of the times.

Understand the 'black dog' expression, given his domestic dramas etc.

A dreadful and woeful design in drab green, and anything but Helvetica please.

Also why no crown or regal element?

[ViccyVFU]

Yep. The Charley stamps are even more boring than the Betty ones !
That is quite an achievement.
Congratulations Royal Mail.

10d Pre Decimal Machins (1st July 1968)

I don't recall the original Machins meeting universal acclaim over 50 years ago, but "we kind of got used to them".

You will acclimatise to Charley's
(though they will, inevitably, be around for "a mere fraction" of the previous design).

[Global Admin]

But your three reasons are in the wrong order for your Trifecta.

Who CARES what order they are typed in?!

If you are shot, beheaded, and badly knifed -- who cares what order they occurred in -- you are still DEAD! Like sales of GB new issue stamps.

I simply said there were 3 reasons sales of GB stamps will totally fall off a cliff in 2023 … offered in no order whatever - and no-one here has argued against one of them, as they will all contribute.

I have a strong feeling more folks will totally cease collecting GB new issues in 2023, more than any other reign change.

For 3 reasons.

1. Charles is hardly popular, never has been, and these stamps are the dreariest anyone could possibly have designed of him - even Diana. Even many Brits here agree.

2. 'End Of An Era'. Lots of folks reluctantly bought the past 10 or 15 years mentally saying - 'I'll draw a line in the sand when she passes and spend that money saved on earlier gaps'. AND they will. This a VAST group of folks.

3. The complete morons at Royal Mail who decided to ad-hoc demonitise every Machin for 60 years, decimating the value of not only all Machin collections globally, but ALL QE2 issues as collateral damage. The QE2 stamp market has COLLAPSED - entirely due to this dumb decision. 'Crisis Of Confidence' Run on the banks type herd mentality. 'Commems Might Be Next' - which of course they might be, with these same cretins in charge. So no-one will buy them, especially with Charlie vignette wearing a shirt collar 3 sizes too large.

A very nasty and unprecedented Trifecta Confluence, that will see new issues sales HALVE (or more) this year over last year, costing the PO mega, mega millions, in MEGA high profit lost New Issue sales. Insane.

[norvic]

Simple. I had to look up a word not in common use outside, apparently, North America and Australia and found this:

bet in which the person betting forecasts the first three finishers in a race in the correct order

There may be other meanings. But don’t blame me if you use expressions unfamiliar to your target audience of Poms.

[Global Admin]

Simple. I had to look up a word not in common use outside, apparently, North America and Australia and found this:

bet in which the person betting forecasts the first three finishers in a race in the correct order

There may be other meanings. But don’t blame me if you use expressions unfamiliar to your target audience of Poms.

Will Charlie still award Knighthoods for Incredibly Boring Off Topic Pedantry? Arise Sir Norvic. Geez, things must be even duller than I imagined over there.

[OldDuffer1]

Was Camilla the designer?

Totally Priceless image.

Perhaps he calls her "Sweet Pea"? Bless!

[ViccyVFU]

Has anyone here decided QEII is "the line" for collecting modern GB?

..... And do you still intend to stick to it?

I've not seen anything in the Kings portfolio, to date, that would make me think "I wish there was one person out there that still used stamps, and sent me one!!.

I have a strong feeling more folks will totally cease collecting GB new issues in 2023, more than any other reign change.

I'd agree with the headline, but my reasoning is slightly different ....

A) Monarch
"Charley popularity" does not really enter the equation. Only on definitives (and maybe the Coronation issue) will we need to endure his chiselled features. The silhouette is so small, and greyed, it could easily be replaced by an egg plant (Aubergine), and no one would even notice.

A Vegetarian future??


(And as its the right emoji, would also connect with the younger generation!!).

B) Availability / Usability
The issue I see with rank and file collections is that now its actually "quite a pain" to come into contact with the new issues...
- The RM "sticker program" is not carried as a stock line by a lot of post offices. (Even the basic values are pushed towards labels).
- Or accepted (well, currently "preferred", but watch this space) in use at Post Office, for overseas mail.

For the new definitives (monarch arrays), and coronation issue, I'll have to go to a Crown P.O. to purchase them, and haul them back to a local PO to get them "handstamped to preference".


C) Long Term Value
In a way, they are selling stickers into a market they don't believe in / see no future in (The future is in parcels), so people can "smell the coffee", and realise there will be a loss of enduring value in the stickers they currently hold.

I've planned a five year program to migrate off all long term holdings, but its going to be a struggle, given the rampant oversupply in the market (exacerbated by the swap scheme).


D) Services Received
There is currently little service differentiation between first and second class postage, but a huge price differentiation. Why pay £1.10 for pot luck (just over 50% chance) of receiving the service.

With 10 first class stickers (N.B. "Only first class") offered in this first issue, I don't see anyone stockpiling them,(even with the price rise appreciation, if bought at old rate).

"Why waste money?" .... especially in todays climate. We are already down to a five day service here, irrespective what they are asking the regulator for ... The whole service is a shambles.


E) Aftermarket Prices
Prices are actually holding up quite well, at present ... but thats not in the rarified strata of collectability, but the more mundane "postage as a use of last resort" wholesale market.

Tennants (Auctioneers) last Wednesday, cash costs, were traded at 52 - 66% of face (so still around the 50% mark, when NVI price revisions kick in).

What was less obvious were the large tranches of small machin values, which auctioneers do not put value to in the descriptions, tucked in envelopes and small stockbooks all over the place, but they also lifted realisations into an overall very pleasing set of results.


F) Stock Burn
I think there will be a push for everyone to use Lizzies "from stock". After all, there must be over (I've not counted them) 1,000 valid Lizzie NVI's in play - no one recognises them all.
Charley will issue about 100 in the first year alone, and these will take time to filter to the discount market (If, indeed, anyone actually buys them initially).

So (and this is where we do agree),

"Simply buy no more, until you actually NEED them",

(by which time we might be on a completely different mechanism anyway, given that 2D barcodes are likely to fail "with high certainty" ).


G) Future Collectables
If I was coming fresh to the fold on the definitive collecting front, I'd be tempted only to look at modern day forgeries, as they appear to be issued "in far fewer numbers", and everyone likes a little bit of rogue history (especially on cover).

[norvic]

Very good summary, I especially like G and will make my list of mint and used offers when I get back home.

[faro]

D) Services Received
There is currently little service differentiation between first and second class postage, but a huge price differentiation. Why pay £1.10 for pot luck (just over 50% chance) of receiving the service.

With 10 first class stickers (N.B. "Only first class") offered in this first issue, I don't see anyone stockpiling them,(even with the price rise appreciation, if bought at old rate).

"Why waste money?" .... especially in todays climate. We are already down to a five day service here, irrespective what they are asking the regulator for ... The whole service is a shambles.

Who uses 1st class stamps for standard letter post by default?
Albeit personally I've no complaints if some do, as that cuts overall losses and helps in some small way to protect the universal service provision...

Since the RM's rates have increased by more than inflation in recent years due to the current agreement they're far better stashed aside to use as payment towards parcels (e.g. 3x1st purchased now +19/20p = effectively £3.04/£3.05 for a 2kg parcel at 2023/24 rates) or, at a pinch, for 2nd class large letters (+5p, scribble "2nd LL" at the top left and look the other way when that's also handled as a first class delivery, for what difference it makes!)

Oh, and it's not so much the five day delivery service as last pickups at postboxes being brought forward from 5pm to 9am in the morning, even at large boxes in major supermarkets.
There's no point expecting the public to pay for a "next day" service when the mail isn't even going to be picked up by then.


But... yes, not being in the same situation as the "general public" with possible "justification" per above, I may well pick up a few half-sheets of the KCIII flowers for my mother to use on sendings to family friends as a "one off" but that'll be quits thereafter, I suspect.

[ViccyVFU]

Who uses 1st class stamps for standard letter post by default?

Still wildly popular, first class stamps in booklets, for consumer to consumer "last minute items".
(Birthday cards, SD cards, presents etc). Obviously bills and xmas can go at the slower pace!!

Since the RM's rates have increased by more than inflation in recent years due to the current agreement they're far better stashed aside to use as payment towards parcels.

When they realise 2D barcodes will not cure their problems, I can foresee them dropping the ability to pay for parcels with stamps.

Oh, and it's not so much the five day delivery service as last pickups at postboxes being brought forward from 5pm to 9am in the morning, even at large boxes in major supermarkets.

Norvic assures me this has been in place for years rurally, but it now seems to be spreading to the cities too, where posties are expected to deliver parcels, then empty post boxes on round, then deliver mail (but only if their electric buggies can hold that much range ).

There's currently an awful lot of parcel costs concealed in "infrastructure costs, to provide the USO", so lets hope Parliament act decisively if these assets are commondered solely for private gain / dividends.

[faro]

When they realise 2D barcodes will not cure their problems, I can foresee them dropping the ability to pay for parcels with stamps.

Heh... do NOT say that, or anything about prohibiting their use for international registered mail!

Suffice to say there may be significantly more resistance to such an approach in the UK than other countries (Poland, Norway, etc.), but the dual fees being introduced with greater discounts for purchasing online labels may well have helped head that off at the pass, despite being a pain in its own right!

The datamatrices have already failed: it's just a question of how much backlash there'll be when they finally get around to proper identification and fee charging for forgeries. Too slow, RM, too slow...

[norvic]

I was shown more 1st class forgery today by my nephew who bought 100 in business sheets from Facebook or eBay.

[ViccyVFU]

I was shown more 1st class forgery today by my nephew who bought 100 in business sheets from Facebook or eBay.

Well, if they are Charles III, he should probably hang on to them for a few days, to give RM a chance to catch up on the real ones

(Forgeries are easiest to distribute "when no one really knows what the genuine ones should look like" !!).

[gavin-h]

Oh, and it's not so much the five day delivery service as last pickups at postboxes being brought forward from 5pm to 9am in the morning, even at large boxes in major supermarkets.

Norvic assures me this has been in place for years rurally, but it now seems to be spreading to the cities too

And, somewhere in between rural and cities, it's been the case in my "garden town by the sea" for several years at on-street post boxes. The post offices (yes, we're "lucky" to still have more than one!) normally state 5pm on their boxes.

But in reality, the "9am" is normally any time late-morning to early-afternoon because of the collection round, of course it would be crazy to expect a postie to appear at every box at precisely 9am to empty it!

Not sure what any of this has to do with stamps of the new King, but to try and drag it rather tenuously back on-topic, a question to ponder:

Apart from the stamps, when will we see the first post boxes with the King Charles cypher?

[Global Admin]

Save many millions of quid, and wait for William. Won't be long.

[Catweazle]

Well I do declare that Djibouti has done it better - perhaps Royal Mail could have forged this one instead?

2022 Djibouti 1000FD Lickable Wallpaper

Even bigger

That's a better scan – almost looks like real flower petals, there!