USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

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billw2
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Re: USA 1861 3c Benjamin Franklin stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by billw2 »

Still showing this way….

Hey if it helps I’d pay big money for an 1861 US 3c Ben Franklin stamp ;)
4C0CAF5C-F193-4D4F-B6FC-25D0192E7EC9.png
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by gavin-h »

billw2 wrote: 30 Jan 2024 18:28 Still showing this way….
Check again, Bill.

I've (hopefully...) used my Moderator Superpowers to amend the thread heading by editing the FIRST post on the thread.

Note: the heading on each INDIVIDUAL post within the thread will not have changed as these pick up the subject of the previous post unless edited individually - I've done that with THIS post but not planning on taking the time to edit the majority of the previous 100 posts. :idea:
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by billw2 »

gavin-h wrote: 31 Jan 2024 02:16
billw2 wrote: 30 Jan 2024 18:28 Still showing this way….
Check again, Bill.

I've (hopefully...) used my Moderator Superpowers to amend the thread heading by editing the FIRST post on the thread.

Note: the heading on each INDIVIDUAL post within the thread will not have changed as these pick up the subject of the previous post unless edited individually - I've done that with THIS post but not planning on taking the time to edit the majority of the previous 100 posts. :idea:

Ahhhh well done!
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Morning all,

As I continue to rearrange my US stamps, I find more and more I struggle with shade variations, and thank you to the poster who provided the link to the colour chart.

While I don’t think these are of much interest, I’d like to put the shades into order, if there is one.
3 c Washington stamps
3 c Washington stamps
There are grill-less variety.

I’m thinking stamp 1 and 3 ordinaries.

Stamp 2: possible rose pink, and has a Washington circular cld mark but all I can make out is the number 18.

Any opinions welcomed, and many thanks as always.

Peckham.
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by billw2 »

Peckham,

From the scan I see what you’re looking at but I suspect it isn’t. One big clue is the perf we’re done with worn perforating pins and that’s generally indicative of an 1866-67 era printing on the 1861 issue stamps.

I know it’s been said a million times but it’s also very tough to tell shades of US stamps of this era from scans, and they can be hard enough to tell in person sometimes. For example, these three 24c 1871s, which you’ve seen before, are all Scott 70c, violet shade and all have PF Certificates as such.
6B8F11D3-7195-44CB-91D7-32F7E8CDC26B.jpeg
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Hi Bill,

Hope alls well and thank you for your reply - also thank you for posting those 24s up, I’m now awaiting the verdict on my one, it’s been about a month now in the US.

That’s a very useful tip to know on the perf as a guide.

Here is the full image on the one I was most interested in.
IMG_0875.png
Everything except the left side looks okay-ish to me perf wise, but shades, perfs and cancels on 1860+ these issues are a big challenge to a novice collector.

Again, thank you for replying.

All the best.

Peckham
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Missed the image out..

Here it is.
3c Washington stamp
3c Washington stamp
I think it’s a closer to what I’m looking at.

All the best.

Peckham
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by stallzer »

Mike McClung has a great write up on the many shades of these if you can find it. I tried to locate it but no joy.

Trying to determine shades on the interwebs isn’t an accurate way to identify shades due to monitors, color reproduction from a scanner or camera,etc.

The only way to determine if it is truly a pink shade is to compare side by side with certified examples.
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Hi Stallzer,

Many thanks I’ve had a look round the site here, and found a few good posts on the subject as you said I would, equally I agree screen resolution etc you can’t form a reliable opinion from them when colour shades are so close.

I’m toying with the idea of getting it looked at as I had a reply from a US expertiser today and they quoted $75 which I don’t think it’s a bad price.

Many thanks again for replying.

Best regards,

Peckham.
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by billw2 »

It’s very tough to tell from a scan.

$75 to get that expertised seems awfully high. Look up Bill Crowe, probably comes up as William T Crowe out of CT.

He does reasonably priced certs and is a well respected US expert who can tell you with 100% certainty if it’s good.

If it’s a rose pink it’s probably not worth $75 fwiw.
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Hi Bill,

Many thanks and hope alls well in your part of the world.

I’ve looked for that chaps website before but couldn’t find it, I see he’s on LinkedIn which I can easily join and contact him direct though.

Costs are what they are at the moment, the main bulk of that $75 is in fedex charges for the return of the stamp.

It’s pointless I think trying to get USA stamps expertised anywhere else other than the USA, and I’ve become country centric on this matter.

If I can get a few stamps that I think are decent candidates for a specialist to take a look at I’ll give it a go, so far my only contenders are a damaged 10c imperf Washington, this 3c and I’ll try and find one other just to make it worth the return courier charge.

I’ll give it some more thought.

Have a good weekend,

All the best

Peckham
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by billw2 »

Peckham,

Was almost 70F and gorgeous today here in Las Vegas! Life is great.

I found Bill’s email address. wtcrowe at aol dot com. I’d send him an email, I’d think standard tracked mail shouldn’t be more than £5-10 or so for a letter to the USA?
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by AdmiralCollector »

Below is a page from a pdf found online at
http://www.stampnewsonline.net/StampNewsOnline-PW/StampID/SI ... 0Blood.pdf
I'm not sure why the first & last stamps of the second and third rows are the same . . .
As other have said here, identifying colors from a computer screen is not the way to go.
Colors of the US 3¢ Washington stamp of 1861.
Colors of the US 3¢ Washington stamp of 1861.
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by VFND55 »

Great article AdmiralCollector, thanks for posting. The article reminds me of the debate from three dealers at a stamp show back in 2008 where they were discussing the stamp I brought to the show (see below). Using their loops to study the color brought out varieties of stamps they have seen before but were indecisive at first between rose pink and pink. After about thirty minutes, two out of the three dealers concluded that is was pink and the one rose pink. All agreed that I should have it certified. Since then, I have decided not to send it in for certification. Maybe one of these days I'll decide otherwise.
US 1861 Washington 3c Pink/Rose
US 1861 Washington 3c Pink/Rose
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Hi Bill,

Many thanks for the email address, I will get an email over to him shortly to get an idea on prices.

Glad to hear your basking in the sunshine, here it’s still winter season, which around April morphs into rainy season.

Admiral posted up - and many thanks for the link and image - which was very helpful in making my mind up that the 3c I was looking at is a common or garden #65.

Thank you both,

Peckham
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by billw2 »

That’s an excellent article on 3 cent shades and Elliot Perry was a famous expert on classic U.S. stamps for sure.

I think it’s quite important to bear in mind, and as I’ve posted, that it can be borderline impossible to pin down any of the 1861s in an EXACT shade that’s absolutely consistent.

You’re working with a combination of these stamps now being in some cases over 160 years old and exposed to who knows what sort of environmental conditions over what’s now what, 8 generations? Plus it’s quite clear to us now that the National Bank Note Company wasn’t worried about being scientifically accurate when mixing up ink back then either.
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Hi Bill

Many thanks for the info there and bit surprising to read that about the NBNC, but it makes perfect sense when the inks were being mixed to recipes by weight, sight and experience.

The album I’m working from was started in 1898.

Here’s an image of the entry’s she made.
Lincoln stamp album
Lincoln stamp album
It’s about 125 years old all with stamps from Victorian period, world wide and they haven’t seen the light of day for about that long I think so maybe colour changes I hope will be limited and many will be fairly true to their original shades.

An antique in its own right age wise, the stamps were added value!

Nothing back on the 24c yet, can’t be much longer!

All the best.

Peckham
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by stallzer »

Found the Mike McClung article from the Chronicle.

See the “1861 Period”


http://chronicle.uspcs.org/pdf/Chronicle_144/10827.pdf
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Re: USA 1861 3c George Washington stamp. Do I have a rare one - or not?

Post by Peckhamrye1 »

Hi Stallzer,

That is indeed very kind of you to post that up for me.

Looks great on a quick skim through, I’ll have the magnifying glasses out en-mass tomorrow!

All the best, and thank you again.

Peckham
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